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gioarmani

How to adjust your rep's timing and beat.

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10:10 Watch Repair

(I had it to about + 15 seconds a day). Last night after a night out with my wife for dinner and wine I decided to give it another adjustment. ?

 

 

What's wrong with you people?

15 sec / day on a 21J? Leave it. What's the downside, showing up 5 seconds early for that noon meeting or 10 seconds early for the midnight rendezvous?

 

To the question, adjusting the timing usually effects the beat, try moving the regulator back where it was and see what happens. You need a timegrapher to adjust beat.

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banza

(I had it to about + 15 seconds a day). Last night after a night out with my wife for dinner and wine I decided to give it another adjustment. ?

 

 

What's wrong with you people?

15 sec / day on a 21J? Leave it. What's the downside, showing up 5 seconds early for that noon meeting or 10 seconds early for the midnight rendezvous?

 

To the question, adjusting the timing usually effects the beat, try moving the regulator back where it was and see what happens. You need a timegrapher to adjust beat.

 

It makes sense! Thanks for the advice.

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Sinowatch

Very helpful thread but the pictures no longer show up?

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maximme

btw, i have another watch that doesn't stop , even when i reverse the second hand....

How could that be ?

 

it just keep on going ,

in that case how to adjust the timing ?

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twofake

If the images have disappeared from this topic, on a movement that has no obvious plus or minus do I just adjust the lever arm near the hair spring (yes I know to only barely move it 1/10th of a mm at a time).

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twofake
Anticipating the next question............

 

To the right for slowing the watch.

 

To the left to speed it up.

 

Tiny movements - then test and redo until you get it right. Do not touch the stud carrier.

 

Since my watch is about +15 sec. a day, is the correction on the pic below is OK ?

 

IMAG0308MOD.jpg

re my last post, this answered the question re no plus or minus marks. Thanks SFE

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Ralle

Hello ,

i would like to regulate my Asian 2836-2 a Little bit .

The fine regulation screw is now complete in the + positon.

I am now uncertain if the coarse adjustment arm in the 2824 the same like in the 2836- 2 ?

In this Link the arm Looks a Little bit other like in my 2836-2 ? Can anyone of you post a photo from the adjustment arm ?

 

Many thanks for your help in advance. !

Edited by Ralle

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dfhtrhjn

Can someone explain how adjusting the amplitude arm on the balance wheel affects the timing?

 

Does having a low amplitude potentially make the watch run fast?

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GenTLe
Can someone explain how adjusting the amplitude arm on the balance wheel affects the timing?

 

Does having a low amplitude potentially make the watch run fast?

There is no "amplitude arm" whatsoever.

There are a regulation and a stud arms. The 1st regulate the timing, the second regulate the isochronism of the balance.

The amplitude is the result of a mixture of effects and can be affected by practically everything that moves in a watch, from the status of the mainspring up to a second hand lightly catching the watch crystal during its motion.

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dfhtrhjn

Ah ok. there's a remarkably little literature on how regulating the isochronism of the balance affects the timing.

 

Under what circumstances would someone need to adjust this arm?

 

What common symptoms would a movement have to indicate the isochonism of the balance wheel needs adjustment? Is there something we can observe? or an asymmetry we can hear like and uneven tick or a gallop?

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GenTLe

Well if the beat error is more than (for me) 0.1ms I try to.put it between 0 and max 0.1.

The beat error is a sign of lack of isochronism, because that error is the difference of time used by the balance when it swing in a direction or in the opposite one after being pushed by the pallet fork.

A beat error influences the time keeping when the watch is in different positions so it is better to keep it as near to 0 as possible.

But remember that once regulated the BE to 0 with the watch face-up this doesn't mean that it will be 0 in all positions (rarely it is!). If the balance is not perfectly "balanced" (like when you put lead weights on your car wheels to balance them) then when the watch is put in a vertical position (i.e. crown-up) you.will get again a beat error. The reason is pretty obvious.

 

And, about the last question, since we are speaking of milliseconds, you can check it only with a timegrapher machine. Eventually also checking the balance rest position once mounted alone on the "clean" (without any other part) main plate. But that's for very expert old watchmakers...

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dfhtrhjn

I'm starting to get a better idea how this works. So what does moving the stud arm clock and counter clockwise do to the balance wheel?

 

Does it adjust how many degrees the balance rotates?

 

Does it adjust the symmetry of the balance rotations? As in the amount time the balance spends rotating in each direction?

 

And if there is a consistent beat error, how does that affect time keeping? Would the watch run faster or slower? Would you want to correct beat error prior to adjusting the regulation arm?

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GenTLe

When you move the stud arm you change the rest position of the balance. And this will impact the isochronism. If the rest position is perfectly centered in regard of the pallet fork then when the pallet fork pushes it the hair spring will (theoretically) give back the same amount of force and therefore the swing will be the same in both directions.

If the balance rest position is not centered then the balance will swing more in the direction of the offcenter part and less in the other direction.

So yes it adjust the balance rotation symmetry (isochronism).

As said the beat error influence the time keeping when the watch is vertical.

And yes you 1st reagulate the BE and then the timing.

 

By the way my Rolex certified watchmaker and friend was telling me this morning that the Rolex movements specs are up to 1ms BE (which for me is a bid error)...

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SamsonAusKognito

Amazing thread,

I'm going to try my luck after getting new tools for this.

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feeder22

Any chance of getting the pictures re-upped?

 

I've got a watch losing around 5 minutes a day! Is self regulating something for me to try, or is 5 minutes a day too much?

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Dendo

Any chance of getting the pictures re-upped?

 

I've got a watch losing around 5 minutes a day! Is self regulating something for me to try, or is 5 minutes a day too much?

Probably too much - 5 minutes a day suggests its not in isochronism or there is something quite wrong

 

- and be careful with regulating watches - many people end up wrecking the timing all together

 

good luck

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trident
Anticipating the next question............

 

To the right for slowing the watch.

 

To the left to speed it up.

 

Tiny movements - then test and redo until you get it right. Do not touch the stud carrier.

 

Since my watch is about +15 sec. a day, is the correction on the pic below is OK ?

 

IMAG0308MOD.jpg

 

I managed to regulate my Citizen successfully, but when I want to regulate my Seiko 7s36 I accidentally move the other lever and the 7s36 stopped moving. Have I done something wrong? How to correct it? Thanks.

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Dendo
Anticipating the next question............

 

To the right for slowing the watch.

 

To the left to speed it up.

 

Tiny movements - then test and redo until you get it right. Do not touch the stud carrier.

 

Since my watch is about +15 sec. a day, is the correction on the pic below is OK ?

 

IMAG0308MOD.jpg

 

I managed to regulate my Citizen successfully, but when I want to regulate my Seiko 7s36 I accidentally move the other lever and the 7s36 stopped moving. Have I done something wrong? How to correct it? Thanks.

 

I have seen it happen that the two levers move together - so it might not even be that you slipped. There is a long laborious technique to adjust the stud carrier to balance the isochronism but really the way to do it is with a timing machine. Send it to someone with a timing machine - that would be the quickest way to sort it.

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plankton

Nice, I need to work on a 21j.

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