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PAM Daylight’s Review (Part III) – PAM188 H Noob2010 vs.PAM188 I Hmaker & Noob2013

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ALE7575

PAM Daylight’s Review (Part III) – PAM188 H Noob 2010 vs. 188 I Hmaker & Noob 2013

 

PAM Daylight’s Reviews

 

 

INTRODUCTION

 

This thread is the third of a group of reviews about replicas of PAM Chrono DAYLIGHTs released in 2013 that I will gradually publish as soon as possible.

I will study only the Daylights released in 2013 from Noob and H maker in comparison with Noob versions started about 2010.

We will consider only the models fitted with clones (actually non 1:1 copies) of Paneari OPXVII movement based in Swiss Valjoux 7753, which are the best possible in 2010 and at this moment.

We will also study a model that we can consider as a Pre-Daylight, a nice watch produced only during 2003 (F-series), which has the same Daylight case and structure, but that had no official name of Daylight, it is the PAM 162.

Therefore will be missing the reviews as follows:

- PAM 251 that has not been improved in 2013

- PAM 356 which is a new release of 2013 without previous versions and already evaluated with Super rep status.

- PAM 326 made of Ti and with blue dial, already improved in 2012 with a new movement clone A7753 with almost correct fonts and Date window placement, this replica is already considered a First Class.

- PAM 327, the same as PAM 326 but with Ti bracelet which has been never replicated.

 

In this thread we will see the review as follows:

- PAM Daylight’s Review (Part III) – PAM188 H Noob 2010 vs. 188 I Hmaker & Noob 2013

 

We have already published:

- PAM Daylight’s Review (Part I) – PAM 250 / 236 – Noob 2010 vs. Noob 2013

http://www.rwg.bz/board/index.php?showtopic=58729

- PAM Daylight’s Review (Part II) – PAM196 H Noob 2010 vs. 196 I Hmaker & Noob

2013

http://www.rwg.bz/board/index.php?showtopic=59961

 

In the near future will be published the reviews as follows:

- PAM Daylight’s Review – PAM 162 Pre-Daylight – Noob 2010 vs. Noob 2013

- PAM Daylight’s Review – PAM 224 – Noob 2010 vs. Noob 2013

 

 

 

 

 

PAM Daylight’s Review (Part III) – PAM188 H Noob 2010 vs. PAM188 I Hmaker & Noob 2013

 

 

In below FIGURE you can see the pics and main features of PAM 188 Luminor Chrono:

 

PAM188-deficopiar.jpg

 

Below a general FIGURE of the gen and the three replicas to be analyzed

 

PAM188-VIEW-compcopiar_zps3c99d38d.jpg

 

 

 

1- DIAL & CRYSTAL

 

Overall finish, colours and layout of three rep dials H maker, Noob 2010 and 2013 are very good and close to the gen.

Noob 2010 version has somehow an appearance of old replica with some evident flaws like the Date window position, but not everything is worse in this old version as we will see in the review.

In below FIGURE 1.A we can see the general comparison of four dials

 

PAM188-DIALS-compcopiar_zps7121e946.jpg

FIGURE 1.A- DIALS PAM 188 - GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

 

 

1.1- DATE WHEEL & NUMERAL/STICK MARKERS @4 & 5

Bellow FIGURE 1.1.A shows the part of dial with the Date Wheel, 4-5 hours numeral markers and little stick minute markers around dial.

 

PAM188-DW4-5-compcopiar_zpsa9fd76dd.jpg

FIGURE 1.1.A- DIAL @4 & @5 DATE WHEEL AND WINDOW – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Noob2010

-DW Window- Noob 2010: Blue marked placement, Gen: Orange marked placement. Window Noob 2010 is placed inwards. Date wheel is placed less recessed than older version, a little closer to gen, but still very recessed

-Date changer- By pusher placed @10 like gen

-DW Fonts- Wrong font shape

-Numeral markers 4 & 5- Font a bit thinner, very noticeable in some markers (“8”,“2”, “5”…)

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

 

-H maker

-DW Window- Almost perfect in size and placement. Well finished edge. We can consider this issue is already corrected enough. Date wheel is almost non recessed like gen

-DW Fonts- Inaccurate font shape and clearly thinner.

-Date changer- By pusher placed @10 like gen

-Numeral markers 4 & 5- Correct font shape and thickness. The best accuracy of three reps

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- more accurate ands bette than Noob versions.

 

-Noob2013

-DW Window- Almost perfect in size and placement. Well finished edge. We can consider this issue is already corrected enough. Date wheel is almost non recessed like gen. The best accuracy of three reps

-DW Fonts- Almost correct font and thickness (few difference), depending on numbers of date, but overall accurate enough. The best accuracy of three reps

-Date changer- By pusher placed @10 like gen

-Numeral markers 4 & 5- Clearly thinner and even more than 2010 version, very noticeable in some markers (“8”,“2”, “5”…)

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

 

 

 

 

1.2- UPPER DIAL- MARKERS 10-11-12-1-2- LUMINOR PANERAI

We will se below the accuracy of upper part of dial as showed in below FIGURE 1.2.A

 

PAM188-UPPERDIAL-compcopiar_zps18435676.jpg

FIGURE 1.2.A- UPPER DIAL – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Noob2010

-Markers

Markers 10-11 12-1-2 are thinner. This is the most noticeable flaw

12 marker- Thinner and displaced to the left side.

10 marker- Thinner, it has inaccurate “0” because gen is more square shaped. It is clearly smaller and placed a bit higher

11 marker– Thinner, placed a bit higher and a bit displaced to the right side

1 & 2marker- Thinner, both placed a bit higher

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

-LUMINOR - A bit thinner fonts. Placed a bit higher in relation to PANERAI and a bit displaced to the left side. See “L” is not aligned with “P” of PANERAI.

-PANERAI- Correct but “R” font is wider

-Daylight- a bit thinner, good placement but with inaccurate and narrower fonts. See “a” and “g”.

 

-H maker

-Markers : all markers have good thickness in general and have more accurate appearance than Noob by far.

12 marker- Correct

10-11-1 & 2 markers- Good thickness and font shape, but all them placed a bit higher and a bit displaced to the right side, mainly “11”. “11” markers has the characters closer than gen. The “0” of “10” has accurate shape whereas Noob versions are not correct.

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Very accurate. The best accuracy

-LUMINOR – Good thickness. “U” font is less rounded. “R” is narrower

-PANERAI- Good thickness and shape fonts with accurate shape. “R” is narrower

-Daylight- Good thickness, good placement but with inaccurate fonts, narrower and a bit smaller. See “a” and “g”.

 

-Noob2013

-Markers

Markers 10-11 12-1-2 in general are thinner, like 2010 version. No modifications.

12 marker- Thinner and displaced a bit to the left side.

10 marker- Thinner, it has inaccurate “0” because gen is more square shaped. It is clearly smaller

11 marker– Thinner, placed higher and displaced to the right side

1 marker- Thinner, placed a bit higher

2 marker- Thinner

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

-LUMINOR - A little bit thicker and taller fonts. And a little bit displaced to the left side. See “L” is not aligned with “P” of PANERAI (but less than 2010 version)

-PANERAI- Correct, but “R” font is a bit wider

-Daylight- a bit thinner, good placement but with inaccurate and narrower fonts. Worse than Noob 2010 and H maker. See “a”, “h” and “g”, and please note the big distance between “D” and “a”. This is the worse Daylight inscription on dial of three versions

 

 

 

1.3- MIDDLE DIAL- SUBDIALS @9 & @6 – STICK BLACK MARKERS @ 3 & 9

Now we will study the middle part of the dial with the seconds subdial @9 and the chrono minute counter subdial @3 and the black stick markers @ 3 & 9.

See FIGURE 1.3.A

 

PAM188-MIDDLEdial-compcopiar_zpse74896b5.jpg

FIGURE1.3.A- MIDDLE DIAL – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Noob2010

-Black stick marker @9- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @9

-Black stick marker @3- Shorter, closer to the DOT @3

-Subdial @9- The black slim markers are accurate the fat markers are shorter and thinner

-Subdial @3- 20 &10 markers are not perfect in font and placement but they are accurate enough. Little black short markers around the subdial are thicker, and fat black markers around the subdial are thicker and shorter.

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

 

-H maker

-Black stick marker @9- Accurate

-Black stick marker @3- Accurate

-Subdial @9- Accurate, the best of three replicas

-Subdial @3- 20 &10 markers are not perfect in font and placement but they are accurate enough. Little black slim and fat markers around the subdial are accurate. The best of three replicas

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Very accurate. The best accuracy of three reps

 

-Noob2013

-Black stick marker @9- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @9

-Black stick marker @3- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @3

-Subdial @9- The black slim markers are accurate, the fat markers are shorter and thinner

-Subdial @3- 20 &10 markers are not perfect in font and placement but they are accurate enough. Little black short markers around the subdial are thicker, and fat black markers around the subdial are thicker and shorter.

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

 

 

 

1.4- LOWER DIAL – MARKERS @7 & 8 – STICK MARKER WITH LUME & SUBDIAL @6

Now we will study the lower part of the dial with the chrono hour counter subdial @6 the numeral markers @ 7 & 8.

See FIGURE 1.4.A

 

PAM188-LOWdial-compcopiar_zpsa072c2e6.jpg

FIGURE1.4.A- LOWER DIAL MARKERS @7 & 8 – SUBDIAL @6 - GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Noob2010

The most noticeable flaw is that fonts are thinner

-Subdial @6- It is accurate in general but markers font are a bit smaller.

-Black stick marker @6- It is a bit shorter and thinner

-Numeral marker 7- Font is thinner and narrower.

-Numeral marker 8- Font is clearly thinner. This is the most inaccurate font

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

-L SWISS MADE L- Correct fonts and correct placement

 

-H maker

H maker is the most accurate dial in 7-8 hours zone

-Subdial @6- It is accurate in general but markers font are a bit narrower.

-Black stick marker @6- Correct

-Numeral marker 7- Correct font shape, thickness and position.

-Numeral marker 8- Correct font shape, thickness and position. The best by far

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Very accurate. The best accuracy of three reps

-L SWISS MADE L- Correct fonts and correct placement

 

-Noob2013

-Subdial @6- It is accurate in general but markers font are a bit smaller.

-Black stick marker @6- It is thinner and placed lower.

-Numeral marker 7- Font is thinner and narrower.

-Numeral marker 8- Font is clearly thinner. This is the most inaccurate font

-Little black stick markers around dial- Accurate

-Little DOT markers with lume around dial- Noob DOTS are a bit bigger than gen

-L SWISS MADE L- Correct fonts and correct placement

 

 

 

1.5- HANDS

-Minute hand- Three versions have the same width, lume and length as gen. Noob versions are a bit longer but no noticeable. As you can see in below FIGURE 1.5.A.

 

PAM188-HANDMINUTE-compcopiar_zpsd2a38749.jpg

FIGURE 1.5.A- MINUTE HAND – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Hour hand- Three versions have the same width, lume and length as gen

 

PAM188-HANDHOUR-compcopiar_zps281d0964.jpg

FIGURE 1.5.B- HOUR HAND – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Subdial @9 @3 @6 little hands- Three versions have accurate subdial hands almost the same as gen, no noticeable differences even in central pin.

 

-Big chrono seconds hand- Both Noob versions have the same chrono second hand, it has the same length than gen but they are clearly fatter form the point to the tail and the diameter of the circle around the pin is clearly bigger. Rep pin is a bit smaller and not as perfect as gen. H maker version has a chrono seconds hand almost the same as gen, maybe a bit thinner in the base, but central circle and pin are very similar to the gen. H maker is the most accurate big chrono second hand by far.

As we can see in below FIGURE 1.5.C

 

PAM196-HANDBIGSECONDS-compcopiar_zps4299a009.jpg

FIGURE 1.5.C- BIG CHRONO SECONDS HAND – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

 

 

1.6 -LUME

Noob 2010 version has a standard lume worse than gen, Noob 2013 version has a Super Luminova lume which arrives close to gen. Both lume are accurate in colour. Don’t trust the colour in FIGURES.

H maker has a very good Super lume, matching gen colour, even maybe stronger than gen. To be purist, this is not accurate but it is a feature very appreciated.

 

 

 

1.7-CRYSTAL

Noob 2010 is fitted with a good sapphire crystal, which is with slightly coloured AR or without AR depending on dealers. Maybe different batches of the same model of rep

Noob 2013 and H maker have sapphire crystal with single AR colourless like gen and very good quality. This is an improvement in relation to Noob 2010 version.

 

 

 

 

 

2- CASE-SET

Case-set finish and shape accuracy are overall good and very similar to gen in three replicas. We will see below more detailed review.

 

 

2.1- VIEW FROM 9 HRS.- DATE CHANGER @10

Below you can see in FIGURE 2.1.A the views of the cases from 9 hours position and the date changer pusher in order to get comparisons.

 

PAM196-from9-comp-FINALcopiar_zpsdf253553.jpg

FIGURE 2.1.A- VIEWS FROM 9 HOURS – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

There is no changes in Noob case, overall accurate case and lugs shape, lugs are a bit fatter than gen. Very good finish in both Noob.

H maker is as good as Noob cases with the same quality of finish and similar accuracy of shape from 9 hrs

 

Below you can see in FIGURE 2.1.B enlarged pics of the cases from 9 hours position showing date changer pusher in order to get comparisons.

Noob 2013 has improved a little the finish of date changer pusher contour and Noob pusher are in general quite accurate, but the inner pusher of the gen has internally hexagonal shape whereas the rep is circular. Anyway we can consider accurate date changer pushers of both Noob versions.

However H maker version has inaccurate construction because either the inner pusher or the pusher contour have circular shape, even the hole in contour to shelter the inner pusher. In this way the date changer pusher of H maker is not accurate and you can notice the differences. See FIGURE 2.1.B

 

PAM196-from9-dateadjust-comp-FINALcopiar_zpsc7078b3c.jpg

FIGURE 2.1.B- VIEWS OF DATE CHANGER PUSHER @10 – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

 

 

2.2- VIEW FROM 3 – SIDE VIEW OF CROWN, CROWN GUARD, LEVER & CHRONO PUSHERS

 

Below you can see in FIGURE 2.2.A the views of the cases from 3 hours position, with side views of Crown, CG, lever and chrono pushers in order to get comparisons.

 

PAM188-from3--compcopiar_zpsea4b58a9.jpg

FIGURE 2.2.A- VIEWS FROM 3 HOURS -SIDE WIEW OF CROWN, CROWN GUARD, LEVER & CHRONO PUSHERS – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

We can see the same as above about finish and accuracy of shapes from 3 hrs

Regarding CG, lever and chrono pushers side view

 

But we need to enlarge the pics to see differences in FIGURE 2.2.B

 

PAM188-from3-AMPLI-compcopiar_zps2f4577dd.jpg

FIGURE 2.2.B- ENLARGED VIEWS FROM 3 HOURS – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

Seeing above FIGURE we have the remarlks as follows:

 

-Noob 2010

-Chrono pushers- Accurate shape, but they are placed lower than gen in relation with the curved cushion shape (green arrow)

-CG- Seems accurate in general, but it is placed, like the pushers, lower in relation to cushion shape. The Upper part (blue arrow) has the same thickness as gen. Noob versions have the best CG

-Crown- the profil is clearly “slim” in comparison with a “fat” gen crown. It is a clear flaw (red arrow).

 

-H maker

-Chrono pushers- Accurate shape, but they are placed clearly lower than gen in relation with the curved cushion shape (green arrow)

-CG- It is placed, like the pushers, clearly lower in relation to cushion shape. The Upper part (blue arrow) is clearly inaccurate and thinner than gen. The worse CG of three versions.

-Crown- the profil is accurate in comparison with a “fat” gen crown. It is a clear improvement in comparison with both Noob versions (red arrow). H maker is the best Crown of three versions by far.

 

-Noob 2013

-Chrono pushers- Accurate shape, they are placed better than 2010 version, but still a bit lower than gen in relation with the curved cushion shape (green arrow)

-CG- Seems accurate in general, it is placed a bit better than 2010 version, but still, like the pushers, a bit lower in relation to cushion shape. The Upper part (blue arrow) has the same thickness as gen. Noob versions have the best CG

-Crown- the profil is clearly “slim” in comparison with a “fat” gen crown, even worse than 2010 version. It is a clear flaw not improved from 2010 version (red arrow).

 

 

 

2.3- BEZEL

Finish and dimensions of bezels are good and accurate in three versions (see previous pics). But there are improvements in the fonts of bezel tachymeter in Noob 2103 and H maker version. See FIGURE 2.3.A

 

PAM188-BEZELFONTS-compcopiar_zpsf89a6568.jpg

FIGURE 2.3.A- BEZEL TACHYMETER FONTS – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 COMPARISON

 

-Bezel fonts- In Noob 2010 version there are differences in fonts in comparison to the gen and they are a bit thicker, less crisp and less clean than gen ones. See clear differences in “1” and “2”, but really almost all characters are different.

Noob 2013 and H maker versions have corrected thickness and fonts shape and you can clearly see that are almost the same as gen. See “1” and “2” to realize the improvement regarding Noob 2010 version, in 2013 versions either Noob or H maker the fonts are very similar to gen characters. This is a clear improvement of Noob 2013 and H maker versions

-TACHYMETRE / TACHYMETER –

G and H-series have TACHYMETRE inscription in the bezel. Although I have seen some H-series with TACHYMETER, maybe because Panerai changed to METER during H-series production or due to changes in repairs.

I-series has TACHYMETER

Noob 2010- is correct because has TACHYMETRE and it is H –series

H maker- Is correct because has TACHYMETER and it is I-series

Noob 2013- is wrong because has TACHYMETRE and it is I-series

 

 

 

2.4-CG, LEVER , CROWN & CHRONO PUSHERS FRONTAL VIEW

 

PAM196-CG-compcopiar_zpsbf201992.jpg

FIGURE 2.4.A- CG, LEVER, CROWN & CHRONO PUSHERS FRONTAL VIEW – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2103 COMPARISON

 

-Noob2010

Finish- of Noob 2010 CG is way worse than gen, with overpolished and uneven surfaces and rounded edges and inner corners, very similar to H maker CG.

Shape- is not completely accurate. The hollow to shelter the crown is bigger than gen and then the external side of the CG is thinner.

Fitting- Noob 2010 CG doesn’t fit the case at the sides.

CG pin -is not as flattened and well finished as gen.

Crown- has nice finish and beveled, but remember it has inaccurate “slim” profile

Crown tube- is a bit longer and inaccurate.

Lever-has inaccurate roller support shape and with roller and very visible roller pin, unlike gen which has not this roller.

Bear in mind that gen PAM 188 and 196 have not roller whereas gen PAM 250 and 251 have roller.

Lever tip- is almost correct, better than H maker but worse than Noob 2013 tip.

Chrono pushers- have accurate shape rounded like gen.

 

-H maker

Finish- of H maker CG is way worse than gen, with overpolished and uneven surfaces and rounded edges and inner corners, very similar to Noob 2010 CG. See the difference of finish with the gen in below FIGURE 2.4.B, lease note the rounded inner corners (orange arrows ) and the overpolished and rounded inner edges (green arrows)

 

PAM196-CG-detailHm-GEN-compcopiar_zpsc7949a88.jpg

FIGURE 2.4.B- CG FINISH FRONTAL VIEW – GEN-H MAKER COMPARISON

 

Shape- of CG is completely accurate. But CG pin is placed higher and inwards.

Fitting- H maker CG seems to fit perfectly the case at the sides.

CG pin- is not as flattened and well finished as gen.

Crown- has nice finish and beveled, besides it has correct “fat“ profile. The best crown and tube of three replicas by far.

Crown tube- is quite accurate.

Lever- has not roller like gen and the shape is accurate.

Bear in mind that gen PAM 188 and 196 have not roller whereas gen PAM 250 and 251 have roller.

Lever tip- shape is a little wrong. The worse of three studied replicas.

Chrono pushers- have inaccurate shape less rounded than gen. The owrse pushers of three versions.

 

-Noob2013

Finish- of Noob2013 CG is as well finished as gen, with uniform surfaces and perfect square edges and inner corners.

Shape- is completely accurate.

Fitting- Noob 2013 CG in the pic doesn’t fit the case at the sides but it is an isolated case from first productions. This is a fixed issue following information and pics of Puretime’s Angus in RG:

http://www.repgeek.com/showthread.php?t=212754[/color[/url]]

CG pin- is not as flattened and well finished as gen, very similar to Noob 2010.

Crown- has nice finish and beveled, but remember it has inaccurate “slim” profile

Crown tube- is a bit longer and inaccurate.

Lever- has not roller like gen and the shape is accurate.

Bear in mind that gen PAM 188 and 196 have not roller whereas gen PAM 250 and 251 have roller.

Lever tip- is very gen-like, the best lever tip shape of three replicas.

The chrono pushers have accurate shape rounded like gen

 

 

 

 

2.5-CASEBACK

Regarding casabacks we need to make two parts because Noob 2010 is H-series whereas H maker and Noob 2013 are I-series. Therefore there are two types of casebacks

We will firstly analyze the rep Noob 2010 H-series

 

-Noob 2010 H-series

PAM 188 H-series was introduced with OP number OP 6637 and the total quantity was 700 units.

See below the FIGURE 2.5.A with the comparison of Noob 2010 H-sereis caseback and gen H-series

 

PAM188-casebackHseries-compcopiar_zps6e2ea088.jpg

FIGURE 2.5.A- CASEBACKS – GEN-NOOB 2010 H-SERIES COMPARISON

 

Finish- Rough in comparison to gen, mainly in the fine brushed circular ring where are LUMINOR and Daylight inscriptions. Correct polished sides

LUMINOR- acceptable accuracy and placement

OFFICINE PANERAI- acceptable accuracy and placement

FIRENZE-1860-AUTOMATIC-CHRONO-STAINLESS STEEL-acceptable accuracy

OP 6637-PB number- Wrong fonts completely inaccurate

H-series -Production number/Total production- Narrower fonts. Correct total H-series production: rep indicates 700 units like gen.

Daylight- acceptable accuracy and placement

Inner inscription Swiss Made- this inscription is missing in 2010 versions

Quality of inscriptions- very good quality in general, almost as deep, clean and crisp as gen. Little inscriptions are worse than gen

 

And now we will analyze the casebacks of H maker and Noob 2013 both I-series.

See below the FIGURE 2.5.B with the comparison of H maker and Noob 2013 I-series casebacks and gen I-series

 

PAM188-casebackIseries-compcopiar_zps1fb941a1.jpg

FIGURE 2.5.B- CASEBACKS – GEN-H MAKER-NOOB 2013 I-SERIES COMPARISON

 

-H maker I-series

PAM 196 I-series was introduced with OP number OP 6637 and the total quantity was 700 units. The same as H series

Finish- A bit rough in comparison to gen but better than Noob 2010 and 2013 version. Correct polished sides. The best finished caseback of three replicas.

LUMINOR- acceptable accuracy and placement

OFFICINE PANERAI- acceptable accuracy and placement

FIRENZE-1860-AUTOMATIC-CHRONO-STAINLESS STEEL- acceptable accuracy and placement

OP 6637-PB number- More accurate than 2010 version but not perfect, because they are a bit taller. A bit wrong placement

I-ser¡es -Production number/Total production- Fonts are inaccurate. Correct total I-series production indicating 700 units like gen.

Daylight- acceptable accuracy and placement

Inner inscriptions Swiss Made- This inscription, missing in 2010 version, is laser engraved in H maker version and in Noob 2013. A little improvement

Quality of inscriptions- very good quality in general almost as deep, clean and crisp as gen.

Overall H amker is the better caseback of three replicas

 

-Noob 2013 I-series

PAM 188 I-series was introduced with OP number OP 6637 and the total quantity was 700 units.

Finish- A bit rough in comparison to gen very similar to Noob 2010 version and worse than H maker, we can say even worse than 2010 version, but maybe it is the pic or the batch. Correct polished sides.

LUMINOR- acceptable accuracy and placement

OFFICINE PANERAI- acceptable accuracy and placement

FIRENZE-1860-AUTOMATIC-CHRONO-STAINLESS STEEL- acceptable accuracy and placement

OP 6637-PB number- More accurate than 2010 version but not perfect. Good placement

I-ser¡es -Production number/Total production- A bit wrong fonts far to perfection. Correct total I-series production indicating 700 units like gen.

Daylight- acceptable accuracy

Quality of inscriptions- very good quality in general, almost as deep, clean and crisp as gen. Little inscriptions are worse than gen

Quality of inscriptions- very good quality in general, almost as deep, clean and crisp as gen.

 

 

 

 

3- MOVEMENT

See below FIGURE 3.A the comparisons

 

PAM196-movement-compcopiar_zps314e3d01.jpg

FIGURE 3.A- MOVEMENTS PANERAI OPXII AND “CLONES” – GEN-NOOB 2010-H MAKER-NOOB 2103 COMPARISON

 

Three replicas are fitted with two different clones (non 1:1 copies) of the Panerai OPXII based in Swiss Vlajoux7753 movement. Maker and dealers announce that they are 1:1 clones, which is not the truth.

Noob 2010 version has the date window in 7750 placement, although it is less recessed that in this movement and the change of date starts about 10 hrs.

In Noob 2013 and H maker versions the date window is already well placed and few recessed like Swiss 7753, but the change of date starts in a point between 10 o’clock and half past 10 hrs. unlike the Swiss 7753.

All rep A7753 movements have WOBBLING chrono minute counter hand, flaw not improved in last versions.

The appearance and rotor decoration and marks are good and similar to gen with some differences like the rotor bearing and some internal details. Good enough in spite of flaws.

H maker has engraved a serial number in the same place of gen movement.

 

 

 

 

4- STRAP AND DEPLOYANT

H maker and Noob 2010 and 2013 versions seem to be fitted with the same quality deployant buckles already well known from these makers. No changes and good quality enough.

Straps are also the same and with already known rep quality: very good for rubber and standard for leather ones. Noob is also offering the good quality SS bracelet of PAM 236.

 

 

 

 

CONCLUSIONS AND EVALUATIONS IN NEXT POST

Edited by ALE7575

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CONCLUSIONS

 

As usually new H maker and Noob 2013 versions have many improvements and some worsenings in comparison with 2010 version.

 

Let’s see firstly the flaws of Noob 2010 version

 

-Flaws of Noob 2010 version

-Wrong date wheel fonts. Almost correct thickness

-Wrong date window placement and size

-Thinner numeral markers in general

-Wrong markers fonts in “10”-“8“

-Other markers some little differences

-DOTs markers with lume around the dial are a bit bigger than gen

-LUMINOR a bit thinner and displaced to the left side and placed a bit higher

-PANERAI has “R” font wider

-Daylight on dial a bit thinner and inaccurate and narrower fonts

-Black stick marker @9- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @9

-Black stick marker @3- Shorter, closer to the DOT @3

-Subdial @9- The black fat markers are shorter and thinner

-Subdial @3- 20 &10 markers are not perfect in font and placement but they are accurate enough. Little black short markers around the subdial are thicker, and fat black markers around the subdial are thicker and shorter.

-Subdial @6 markers font are a bit smaller.

-Black stick marker @6 is a bit shorter and thinner

-Wrong bezel tachymeter fonts

-Wrong shape of big chrono seconds hand

-CG and chrono pusher are placed a bit lower in relation to cushion shape edge.

-Bad finish in CG, overpolished, with rounded inner edges and corners

-Bad fitting CG-case, showing gaps

-Wider CG hollow to shelter the crown

-Bad finish of CG pin

-Wrong shape of lever part pushing the crown

-Wrong lever roller with very evident roller pin, because gen has not this device

-“Slim” crown

-Wrong crown tube

-Rough finish on caseback

-Inaccurate OP6637 and PB serial number fonts and position

-Inaccurate fonts of Production number and total

-Inner caseback SWISS MADE inscription is missing

-Movement starts date change about 10,30 hrs.

-Wobbling chrono minute counter hand

-Standard crystal with standard blue coloured AR

-Standard quality rep lume

 

We will see below the improvements and worsening included in H maker and Noob 2013 versions in comparison to Noob 2010

 

-Improvements of H maker version

-Correct date window placement and size

-Almost correct thickness of numeral fonts. The best accuracy than three replicas

-Correct font in marker “10”

-Better “8” font almost completely accurate

-Almost correct DOT markers shape and thickness. The best of three replicas.

-Better non recessed Date wheel

-LUMINOR is aligned with PANERAI

-LUMINOR, PANERAI and Daylight on dial with correct thickness

-More accurate Subdial @9

-More accurate Subdial @3

-More accurate black stick markers @3 and @9

-Correct black stick marker @6

-Correct bezel tachymeter fonts

-Correct shape of big chrono seconds hand

-Correct fitting CG-case

-Correct width of CG hollow

-Correct shape of lever part pushing the crown

-Lever without roller, like gen

-Correct “fat” crown like gen

-Correct crown tube

-Better caseback finish

-Better fonts and placement in OP6637 and PB serial number

-Laser engraved caseback SWISS MADE inscription

-High quality sapphire crystal with high quality single colourless AR like gen

-High quality Luminova super lume

-Serial number engraved in movement bridge

-Worsenings of H maker version

-Date fonts are thinner and inaccurate

-LUMINOR and PANERAI “R” font is narrower

-Chrono pushers and CG are placed lower in relation to cushion shape edge

-Crhono pushers frontal shape are wrong, less rounded

-CG side shape from 3 hrs. is different with thinner part over the lever

-CG finish is even worse than Noob 2010 with a lot of overpolishing and very rounded inner edges and corners.

-CG pin finish is even worse than Noob 2010

-Wrong CG pin placement

-Date changer pusher @10 completely round and wrong

-Worse shape of lever tip

 

-Improvements of Noob 2013 version

-Correct date window placement

-Correct date wheel fonts

-Better non recessed Date wheel

-Correct bezel tachymeter fonts

-Little better side placement (higher like gen) of CG and chrono pusher in relation to cushion shape edge

-Correct finish of CG very gen-like with square inner edges and corners

-Correct fitting CG-case (last batches)

-Correct width of CG hollow

-Correct shape of lever part pushing the crown

-Lever without roller, like gen

-A bit better lever tip shape

-Better fonts and placement in OP6637 and PB serial number

-Better fonts of production number and total

-Laser engraved caseback SWISS MADE inscription

-High quality sapphire crystal with high quality single colourless AR like gen

-High quality Luminova super lume

-Worsenings of Noob 2013 version

-Worse accuracy of Daylight inscription on dial

-A little worse “slim” crown (few noticeable)

-LUMINOR fonts are a bit taller

-Black stick marker @6 is placed lower.

-Wrong TACHYMETRE inscription on dial, I-series must be TACHYMETER

 

Let’s see below the remaining flaws of new versions:

 

Remaining flaws in H maker version

-Wrong placement of some numeral markers

-“11” marker has the characters closer than gen

-Numeral fonts are still a little bit thicker

-Date wheel fonts are Thinner and with inaccurate shape.

-LUMINOR and PANERAI “R” font is narrower

-Inaccurate narrower and smaller fonts of Daylight on dial

-Subdial @6 markers fonts are a bit narrower.

-Stick marker @6 is shorter

-Chrono pushers and CG are placed lower in relation to cushion shape edge

-Chrono pushers frontal shape are wrong, less rounded

-CG side shape from 3 hrs. is different with thinner part over the lever

-CG finish is even worse than Noob 2010 with a lot of overpolishing and very rounded inner edges and corners.

-CG pin finish is even worse than Noob 2010

-Wrong CG pin placement

-Date changer pusher @10 completely round and wrong

-A bit wrong lever tip shape

-Wrong fonts in caseback engravings OP-PB and production/total

-Movement starts date change about 10,30hrs.

-Wobbling chrono minute counter hand

 

Remaining flaws in Noob 2013 version

-Thinner numeral big markers in general

-Wrong markers fonts in “10”-“8“

-Other markers some little differences

-DOTs markers with lume around the dial are a bit bigger than gen

-LUMINOR- A little bit thicker and taller fonts. And a little bit displaced to the left side.

-PANERAI “R” font is a bit wider

-Daylight a bit thinner, with inaccurate and narrower fonts. Worse than Noob 2010 and H maker. The worse Daylight inscription on dial of three versions

-Black stick marker @9- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @9

-Black stick marker @3- Thinner and shorter, closer to the DOT @3

-Subdial @9- The black fat markers are shorter and thinner

-Subdial @3-Little black short markers around the subdial are thicker, and fat black markers around the subdial are thicker and shorter.

-Subdial @6 markers font are a bit smaller.

-Black stick marker @6 is a bit shorter and thinner and is place lower

-Wrong TACHYMETRE inscription on dial, I-series must be TACHYMETER

-Wrong shape of big chrono seconds hand

-Very “slim” crown

-Wrong crown tube

-Wrong fonts in caseback engravings OP-PB and production/total

-Movement starts date change about 10,30 hrs.

-Wobbling chrono minute counter hand

 

Bearing in mind above considerations we can see that the new versions are better than Noob 2010 version, although there are also some worsenings added.

 

 

-Which is the best version available for PAM 188, H maker or Noob 2013?

The answer to this question depends, as many times, on personal taste.

 

Can you live with the more evident flaws of each version?

 

-If you choose Noob 2103 you will get perfect CG finish and date fonts, but overall thinner markers noticeable throughout the dial, inaccurate big chrono second hand and “slim” crown

-If you choose H maker you will get more accurate dial, but completely wrong date fonts, way worse CG finish with overpolished and rounded edges, thinner CG and inaccurate position of CG and chrono pushers.

You have to decide with above info

 

 

 

 

EVALUATIONS

 

Bear in mind that the analysis of this review is very detailed and with many enlargements of the FIGURES, many flaws above mentioned, although existent, are many times few noticeable and by side by side comparisons.

Three studied replicas are very well manufactured and overall quality is awesome.

Considering the improvements and remaining flaws, we can consider that H maker and Noob 2013 are in the same level, with a slight advantage of H maker due to the big Noob flaw of thinner markers, although the bad CG finish of H maker is very disappointing. Noob 2010 is in a lower level.

 

There are many flaws in three replicas to get a Super rep status (although the solid caseback) but the great manufacture quality gives them the First Class status

We can say that Noob 2010 version is a First Class replica of low level and H maker and Noob 2013 are First Class replicas of medium-high level

 

We must wait for new releases to get a real Super replica of PAM 188.

 

 

***********************************************************************************************

 

 

Please inform about your comments regarding above review in order to improve it for everyone in the forum

Sorry for the possible mistakes

 

Waiting for next Daylight’s review

 

Thanks for reading

ALE

Edited by ALE7575

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matjalee

WOWWWWWW.....................................What a Reviewwww......!!!!!!!

 

This kind of hard work and passion specially from you ALE, will make this hobbys remain special....and worth to follow. I've been following your review on RWI and RWG forum for about 6 month and the result, PAM. 111 v3 noob, KW 359, KW 388 and DSN 183 new born..............( :giggle: )

 

I don't know what this PAM forum without your present and your hard work

 

Thank You ALE.....Great ..great JOB

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Corv99

Wow , yet again an awesome review Ale, thanks for sharing!

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ALE7575

Thanks friends you really are encouraging to follow

You are very kind for your comments

 

ALE

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ALE7575

Thanks Haltec

You are really kind

ALE

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IgnitionDream

Amazing review, thank you for sharing all detailed information.

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Khronos

Your reviews are by far the most informative and a great source of information needed before any purchase. I admire your dedication and passion for PAM's and your outstanding sense for details. I'd like to thank you for your hard work and all the information you provide to us!!

 

Regards,

 

Ales

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ALE7575

Hi friends I'm really overwhelmed by your kind comments

That encourages me to continue in this way

Thanks

ALE

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Kuyajeje

Great article and very informative thanks for all your insights and efforts to post this informative threads

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chunkyskillz

Great review. I have a noob question. Is the Hmaker the same as H-factory??

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kime

WOW that is a truly amazing review. Thanks for the effort.

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watchlvr91

ALE, thanks for such an informative and detailed review!

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Rolexwatchman

looks good! Maybe next version will be more accurate

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f150intally

Ale, you are such a wonderful contributor to this community. Thanks so much for your comprehensive reviews!

 

PS...would mods consider sticking this three part review series?

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