ALE7575 24 Posted March 12, 2016 This thread is a extract from PAM Reference GUIDE of PAM 535 "Reference PAM REVIEW-GUIDE" - Replica Search, Identification, Evaluation & Selection. https://www.replica-...n-amp-Selection This thread will give you all information, data and links about the PAM 535 reps published in the main forums and the comments and evaluations made by myself after reading and study the reps, all available information and all the pics and QC pics published and received by e-mail and PM. As usually, the final evaluation that I have given, although considered after many hours of study and trying to be an average of general consensus, could have, unavoidably, some subjective component. Anyway, with all comments and links included in this thread you can get info enough to make your own Evaluation more adapted to your taste. People could easily get many different opinions regarding the final conclusions. Owner opinions are usually based in their own reps (one or two units) and sometimes are biased to their reps. As above commented I have tried to be as impartial as possible and to get and average of the general opinions and myself one. PAM 535 LUMINOR 1950 GMT – Overview and Evaluation of all reps – March 2016 EVALUATIONS: GOOD REP ( KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 Inverted ) GOOD REP Bordering First Class Status ( KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved KP9001-V2.5 ) GOOD REP ( ZFac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved ZP9001-V2.5 ) The gen PAM 535 is a GMT Luminor 1950 42mm made of polished SS, released in 2014 Q-series, and fitted with a Panerai Manifattura movement P.9001 with 3days Power Reserve indicator in the movement bridges. You can see this movement trough a display sapphire caseback. This watch was released together with the PAM 537, the main difference is that PAM 537 has the Power Reserve indicator placed on the dial surface about @4 hrs., because it is fitted with a P.9002 movement. There are also other little differences: PAM 535 has a chromed polished GMT hand whereas in PAM 537 is black, due to the PR indicator on dial of PAM 537 the word PANERAI is placed together with LUMINOR and GMT, that makes more balanced and elegant the PAM 535 dial, PAM 535 has black strap and PAM 537 has brown strap. The main characteristic of these watches is the nice Paris Hobnail dial. This textured dial is also known as Clou de Paris or Nails of Paris. This ParisHobnail dial features a guilloché pattern of hollowed lines that intersect to form tiny pyramidal shapes inspired by the streets of Paris. This subtle detailing, a classic design element of fine Swiss watchmaking, handsomely enhances Panerais classic Super-Luminova Arabic numerals, hour markers, and subdials. Therefore these watches are the same as PAM 329 and 321 but with the Hobnail dial and without “9” marker, that absence od “9” allows a bigger seconds subdial and a more overall balanced dial. GEN PAM 535 TECHNICAL DETAILS MOVEMENT- Automatic mechanical, Panerai P.9001 calibre, executed entirely by Panerai, 13¾ lignes, 7.9 mm thick, 29 jewels, Glucydur® balance, 28,800 alternations/hour. Incabloc® anti-shock device. Power reserve 3 days, two barrels. 229 components. FUNCTIONS- Hours, Minutes, Small Seconds, Date, GMT, Power Reserve Indicator on the back, Seconds Reset CASE- Diameter 42 mm, AISI 316L Polished Steel BEZEL- Polished Steel BACK- See - through sapphire crystal DEVICE PROTECTING THE CROWN- (Protected as a trademark) Brushed Steel DIAL- Black with Paris hobnails, luminous Arabic numerals and hour markers. Date at 3 o’clock, seconds at 9 o’clock. WATER RESISTANCE- 10 bar (~100 metres) STRAP- Calf Assolutamente, Black, Ecru/ MM Standard -PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 Inverted January 2015- KW-V6Fac released a rep of PAM 535 Q-series fitted with a decorated movement like P.9001 based on A7750 with inverted layout and with false Power Reserve indicator. Since this movement is A7750 based, the balance wheel is placed @11 instead of @7 like gen movement and is much bigger than gen. The overall layout is inverted, like a mirror image of the gen. The balance cock decoration is very similar to the gen and looks much more accurate than ZFac decorations. The balance wheel “hole” is bigger than in ZFac movements and looks similar to the gen. The brushing and finish are very good, better than in ZFac movements. Bridges inscriptions have accurate fonts. The finish, colour and thickness of fonts are accurate enough but a bit thicker and worse than ZFac inscriptions and with some variations between batches. There is always in decorated inverted layout movement a controversial matter about the orientation of the inscriptions on bridges. As above said the shape of decoration bridges is like a mirror image of the gen shape. But the inscriptions cannot be a mirror image, because in this case they would be unreadable. Small inscriptions like SWISS MADE and TWENTY-NINE (29) EWELS, are orientated differently from the gen, they start and finish opposite the gen ones. This different orientation, due to the small fonts, is not noticeable in real size. But the big inscription CAL.P.9000 XXXXXX needs a different treatment because the size of the fonts will do noticeable the inaccuracies. In the gen, CAL.P.9000 inscription is placed to be read from the center of the movement and finishes near the balance wheel. It is impossible in a rep inverted layout movement to keep both conditions. ZFac has chosen to keep the reading from the center but then the inscription starts from the balance wheel side instead of finishing. KW has chosen finishing the inscription near the balance wheel and to turn the fonts to be read from outside the movement. Both are inaccurate in some way. The order of preference will be a taste matter. This inverted KW movement is overall more accurate than inverted equivalent from ZFac. Bellow is showed KW decorated inverted movement in comparison with the gen. Pic at the center shows the movement in the same alignment (see the crowns). The Pic at the right side shows the rep movement rotated to match the position of the gen balance wheel. GEN P.9001 - KW DECORATED A7750 INVERTED COMPARISON Center- WATCHES IN THE SAME POSITION Right side-WATCHES ROTATED TO GET MATCHING. See the crowns in different position This is a nicely made rep but unfortunately maker has made a brushed case whereas gen is all polished. **** See below (after the comments about ZFac version) the comparison of this KW-V6Fac version with ZFac and other KW-V6Fac version, with pros and cons **** We can evaluate this rep as Very good rep bordering First Class status. Mainly bearing in mind the nice finish and appearance. More info here: https://www.replica-...lack-asso-strap by jphol402 Review: https://www.replica-...c-%96-42MM-quot by mysterio -PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved KP9001-V2.5 May 2015- KW-V6Fac released the same rep above commented of PAM 535 Q-series, but now with corrected polished case and fitted with a decorated movement like P.9001 based on A7750 with NON-inverted layout, with false Power Reserve indicator and improved bridges decoration, changing the “jewel” near the false escapement wheel. In the first NON-inverted rep movement this “jewel” was introduced in a hollow machined in the plate (like is the gen P.9000), but gen P.9001 has not above commented hollow and the “jewel” is placed in the plate surface, this is the last improvement included in this decorated movement A7750 based (if you know this matter it is easily noticeable). We will call it KP9001-V2.5 NON-inverted Improved. Since this movement is A7750 based, the balance wheel is much bigger than gen and it is still placed @11 instead of @7 like gen movement, but it has correct layout the same as gen. Bridges shape is not yet a mirror image of the gen but a copy of the gen bridges shape. Balance cock orientation is now exactly the same as gen. In the same way the inscriptions are placed and oriented just like gen. This NON-inverted layout is achieved by a technical trick: Maker has used a false decoration of balance cock in the same orientation as gen. In this case maker has not reduced the real balance cock, just like ZFac improved V2.5 decorations, and leaves it hidden under the regulation device and the false escapement wheel. It is really enough, because you cannot see the real balance cock without a close inspection and always knowing this matter. This avoids the possible problems produced by the reduction of the real balance cock. As above commented maker has used a false decoration of balance cock in the same orientation as gen has, in this movement the shape of this decoration balance cock is much more accurate than ZFac V2, very similar to ZFac improved V2.5. In this way the movement main bridges can get a layout the same as the gen watch, with bridges inscriptions placed in correct orientation. The brushing and finish are very good, better than in ZFac movements. Bridges inscriptions have accurate fonts. The finish, colour and thickness of fonts are accurate enough but a bit thicker and worse than ZFac inscriptions and with some variations between batches. But we have to say that ZFac movements have overall better inscriptions, even in the rotor, with thin fonts, sharp and well defined engravings. However the false power reserve indicator is much more accurate and nicer in KW version. The overall layout is correct, but the accuracy of inscription positions, in relation with the case, is impossible because, as above said, rep balance wheel is placed @11, then all inscriptions are displaced due to that. This movement has a shape and size of the balance wheel “hole” very accurate, getting a great gen-like appearance. Besides this movement, as above commented, improves the decoration avoiding the hollow of the “jewel” near the false escapement wheel. With above mentioned features this KP9001-V2 Improved movement has better accuracy than previous version, making this movement the most accurate decorated A7750 based P.9001 on May 2015. Although above improvements always bear in mind that, despite these movements have NON-inverted layout, they still have the balance wheel placed @11 instead of @7 like gen. Bellow is showed movement KP9001-V2 Improved in comparison with the gen. Pic at the center shows the movement in the same alignment (see the crowns). The Pic at the right side shows the rep movement rotated to match the position of the gen balance wheel. GEN P.9001 - KW DECORATED A7750 NON-INVERTED IMPROVED COMPARISON Center- WATCHES IN THE SAME POSITION Right side-WATCHES ROTATED TO GET MATCHING. See the crowns in different position As you can see in above pic, everything is placed in the same orientation but in different position from gen and the balance wheel zone (balance wheel “hole” and decoration of balance cock) seems in this movement much more accurate than in ZFAc V2, very similar to ZFac V2.5. This is another well made rep with awesome finish and appearance, now with correct polished case like gen. Unfortunately there are other important flaws. **** See below (after the comments about ZFac version) the comparison of this KW-V6Fac version with ZFac and other KW-V6Fac version, with pros and cons **** We can evaluate this rep just as good rep. More info here: https://www.replica-...6F-Best-Edition by Rspr https://www.replica-...ost-(pic-heavy) by squee -PAM 535 ZFac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved ZP9001-V2.5 November 2015- ZFac released a rep of PAM 535 Q-series . This rep is fitted with a ZP9001-V2.5 improved decorated movement like P.9001 with correct NON-inverted layout still based on A7750, but improved in relation with the previous version V2. This movement has a lfalse Power reserve indicator. Since this movement is A7750 based, the balance wheel is much bigger than gen and it is still placed @11 instead of @7 like gen movement, but it has correct layout the same as gen. Bridges shape is not yet a mirror image of the gen but a copy of the gen bridges shape. Balance cock orientation is now exactly the same as gen. In the same way the inscriptions are placed and oriented just like gen. This NON-inverted layout is achieved by a technical trick: Maker has used a false decoration of balance cock in the same orientation as gen, the same as previous version, but in this case maker has not reduced the real balance cock, just like KW decorations, and leaves it hidden under the regulation device and the false escapement wheel. It is really enough, because you cannot see the real balance cock without a close inspection and always knowing this matter. This is the first improvement, avoiding the possible problems produced by the reduction of the real balance cock. As above commented maker has used a false decoration of balance cock in the same orientation as gen has, but in this movement the shape of this decoration balance cock is much more accurate than previous one, this is the second improvement. In this way the movement main bridges can get a layout the same as the gen watch, with bridges inscriptions placed in correct orientation. The brushing and finish are good, but not as nicely made as in KW decorations. Bridges inscriptions are more accurate in fonts and better defined than inverted version. We have to say that the new ZP9000-V2.5 has very nice inscriptions, even in the rotor, with thin fonts, sharp and well defined and in my opinion clearly better than previous inverted versions from ZFac or KW. Only the false Power reserve indicator is less accurate and worse than KW version. The overall layout is correct, but the accuracy of inscription positions, in relation with the case, is impossible because, as above said, rep balance wheel is placed @11, then all inscriptions are displaced due to that. In this movement maker has introduced another improvement modifying the shape of bridges decoration to get a rep balance wheel “hole” almost the same as gen. With above mentioned improvements this ZP9001-V2.5 movement has better accuracy than previous version, making this movement the most accurate decorated A7750 based P.9001 in 2015 together with the KW decorated P.9001 NON-inverted KP9000-V2.5 Those are significant improvements but always bear in mind that, although these movements have NON-inverted layout, they still have the balance wheel placed @11 instead of @7 like gen. Bellow is showed New movement ZP9001-V2.5 in comparison with the gen. Pic at the center shows the movement in the same alignment (see the crowns). The Pic at the right side shows the rep movement rotated to match the position of the gen balance wheel. GEN P.9001 – ZFac DECORATED A7750 NON-INVERTED IMPROVED COMPARISON Center- WATCHES IN THE SAME POSITION Right side-WATCHES ROTATED TO GET MATCHING. See the crowns in different position As you can see in above pic, everything is placed in the same orientation but in different position from gen and the balance wheel zone (balance wheel “hole” and decoration of balance cock) seems in this movement much more accurate than in ZFAc V2. This is a nicely made rep, not as nicely made as KW but good enough, but unfortunately maker has made a brushed case whereas gen is all polished. **** See below the comparison of this rep with KW-V6Fac versions, with pros and cons **** We can evaluate this rep just as good rep. TO BE CONTINUED IN NEXT POST Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ALE7575 24 Posted March 12, 2016 **** PAM 535 year 2015 reps - COMPARISON REVIEW ZFac vs. KW-V6Fac **** We need just compare Zfac with the two versions of KW-V6Fac in a whole, since KW-V6Fac reps are the same just changing the movement, above reviewed, and the correct polished case for the last version from KW-V6Fac. CASE Mid case is inaccurate in both makers, the cushion shape is accurate enough but the lug shape and size is completely wrong. Both reps have fatter lugs and with the upper part very close to the cushion shape edge, whereas gen upper part of the lugs is really detached from the edge of the cushion shape. Overall shape is better in ZFac although it is completely wrong, and the position of the lug holes is better in KW-V6Fac but with the overall inaccuracy of the lugs that feature is irrelevant. In below pics we can see the differences above commented. PAM 535 LUG AND CASESET SHAPE – GEN - KW/V6Fac – ZFac COMPARISON The distance between the upper part of the lugs and the cushion shape edge is really evident and can be seen in below pics indicated by the orange arrow PAM 535 DISTANCE BETWEEN LUGS AND CUSHION SHAPE EDGE – GEN–REP COMPARISON As previously commented, gen Mid case is made of polished SS. ZFac and first KW-V6Fac version have really inaccurate brushed case. Only the last NON-inverted movement version from KW-V6Fac has the correct polished case. The finish of this case is awesome and with strong gen-like appearance BEZEL In the same pics you can see that ZFac bezel is really higher and inaccurate, KW-V6Fac is not perfect but it is good enough. CROWN GUARD CG is good enough in both reps, just the angled shape of the central hollow is less pronounced in ZFac. REG. T.M. engravings are not very accurate but are good enough and the differences are not very noticeable. The chamfered corners are more marked and less consistent in relation to the small and nice chamfered of the gen. The lever has more sharp top edges on reps, and the pin of the roller is worse finished in both reps and bigger in ZFac. The CG pin has very rounded edges in both reps in comparison with a flatter gen pin. DIAL Layout of the dial is accurate enough in both reps. No noticeable flaws. Markers are accurate leaving aside “6” marker which has a more closed inner horizontal stroke that arrives closer to the vertical stroke in both reps. Lume colour is accurate enough in both reps Hobnail textured surface is nice and well made in both reps Dial inscriptions are well placed, have accurate fonts, mainly in KW-V6Fac which are almost perfect. The colour is a bit brownish in gen and maybe the rep inscripotions are a bit more brownish in KW and a bit less brownish in ZFac. Both reps have nice glossy and raised inscriptions. Gen seconds subdial @9 has a very evident raised contour and seems really recessed. Both reps have less evident contour (less sharp) and seemingly less recessed, although KW-V6Fac subdial is a bit better. HANDS and CP Rep hands are accurate and well finished. Nothing to be commented KW-V6Fac has accurate and nicely polished CP with correct size ZFac CP is the typical ZF CP with raised rim contour. I don’t like it CRYSTAL Reps have accurate AR colourless coated crystal although rep crystal is a bit more raised and with bigger bevelled than gen. CASEBACK Caseback is really thicker on reps, mainly on ZFac which clearly protrudes from the case, indeed the ZFac lies in the caseback instead of the bottom of the lugs. KW-V6Fac is also thicker but the difference is clearly smaller. Caseback engravings are well placed enough and have accurate enough fonts, although are better in KW-V6Fac CONCLUSIONS The display caseback with Manifattura movements avoids the Super rep evaluation, but the obviously wrong mid case doesn’t even allow a First Class evaluation. The brushed case of two versions downgrades a lot the evaluation of the affected reps. Despite above commented, these reps have nice finish and the look is overall very good. Polished KW-V6Fac version is indeed one of the best finished reps and has strong gen-like appearance, mainly if you don’t know the real flaws. We can give an evaluation of very good rep bordering First Class status to KW-V6Fac with polished case and fitted with A7750 NON-inverted Improved. The other two version would be just good reps PAM 535 REP links: -PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 Inverted http://www.kuvarsit....roduct_id=32574 http://puretime.watc...so-strap-p9001/ http://www.tswatchlt...best-p9001.html http://www.intime.co...trap-p9001.html http://www.ttw8488.c...oducts_id=12951 -PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved KP9001-V2.5 http://www.torobravo...product_id=1885 -PAM 535 ZFac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved ZP9001-V2.5 http://puretime.watc...own-asso-strap/ http://puretime.watc...ray-asso-strap/ http://www.torobravo...product_id=1834 http://www.intime.co...asso-strap.html GEN links: http://watch-test.co...-pam-535-y-537/ http://www.bernardwa...-42-GMT/PAN1099 http://forums.watchu...-a-1367905.html http://www.watchpros...7263&pi=6561453 Thanks for reading ALE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mbernard356 0 Posted May 11, 2016 Does this model, PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved KP9001-V2.5, have the same operation of the GMT hand as same as the gen in 12 hour basis? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ALE7575 24 Posted May 12, 2016 Does this model, PAM 535 KW-V6Fac Q-series w/P.9001 decorated A7750 NON-Inverted Improved KP9001-V2.5, have the same operation of the GMT hand as same as the gen in 12 hour basis? NO, of course NO All rep movements are GMT 24 hrs working ALE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
