gggarl 45 Posted December 1, 2020 So, i just introduced myself in the new members area... And here we go with my first contribution or i'd better say question. I am ready to buy 2 reps, a vintage Sub to abuse of as a daily workhorse and one of those newer Datejusts with PVD treatment, Blaken version for the weekends. Now, my questions are: -Does anybody here own one of those PVD reps? -Does anybody here own one since some time? -Does anybody in here know how that PVD metal surface looks when it gets scratched? Is it just a surface treatment that goes easily away with usage? I understand the gen PVD treatment should hold up to heavy usage, but is it the same for the PVD on these reps? I think the reflection-less dark metal looks very good to me, but it wouldnt look good if a scratch or a dent would reveal the SS underneath on such a watch... I would be interested in seeing pics of your Blakens or Pro Hunters that have been worn for a while to understand how the metal becomes after some time, Thank You very much in advance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadApple 13,079 Posted December 1, 2020 Not a popular watch finish on here especially on a Rolex so you may struggle for a response. You could look on other brands especially on M2M to see how the PVD / DLC ages. If you want to get away from coated steel you would be better looking at ceramic as that is bulletproof but it would mean another brand other than Rolex 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gggarl 45 Posted December 1, 2020 thanks @BadApple interesting answer... the rep i intend to get is this: as you can see from InTime. Unnecessary to say that i really like this one, for now keeping an eye on Rolex reps as a true classic newbie i should follow the usual path thanks for helping me out Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadApple 13,079 Posted December 1, 2020 Rolex are shyte - they scream fake on anyone's wrists even gens. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aramis2288 6,133 Posted December 1, 2020 (edited) Hi @gggarl, I have never owned a PVD or DLC treated rep watch, but I used to have a high-quality microbrand watch finished with DLC treatment. Based on my experiences I will provide you with a few suggestions. Baseline - you will find 2 basic types of coating: PVD and DLC. PVD has a matte finishing and DLC shiny - it looks like ceramic. In general, DLC has an opinion of tougher and more resilient one. Having said that, the 1st and probably the most important thing you need to consider is that independently on what type of coating you are gonna go for it will start wearing off sooner or later. Sure, depending on how careful you are, how often you are wearing the watch as well as the quality of the coat on the rep it may sustain more or less abuse but still, eventually you will start seeing the damage. It's the same with gold plated reps - here however it's easier to find a jeweller who can re-plate the watch with a new layer of rose gold - with PVD/DLC once it scratched off you are screwed. The way the wearing off coating will look is in my opinion pretty bad. the base material is stainless steel (silver colour), while the coating is black. What you will start seeing are contrasted silver scratches on the otherwise black surface. It will be visible. The most delicate areas are the edges as well as (especially with the Rolex you are showing above) the clasp. The sticking out crown logo will probably get scratched quite soon. I do understand why you wanna buy a dark watch (I am a fan of this sort of look as well). I wanted to get a DLC Rolex Milgauss a while ago but the reason why I gave up the idea was that I knew that sooner or later the rep will look hideous. If you care about being able to keep your rep looking fresh for years to come but still want a black watch you are left with 2 options: going for full ceramic pieces (as BadApple suggested above) or forged carbon. The main downside is a fairly limited portfolio of choices (and no Rolex reps available). In either case, what you may want to check as an alternative choice are: Ceramic - the VSF Omegas (Planet Ocean 600m & Seamaster Professional 300m), Panerai Ceramica lines, some IWC Pilot models and for real carbon Panerai Carbotech line (Luminor Marina & Submersible) also I guess some versions of Hublot Big Bang. Cheers. Edited December 1, 2020 by Aramis2288 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadApple 13,079 Posted December 1, 2020 Here is full solid ceramic on a Blancpain Bathyscaphe - it's a dull dark grey. Many factories use DLC and PVD onto steel to get a faux finish be that ceramic or even Titanium. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gggarl 45 Posted December 1, 2020 49 minutes ago, Aramis2288 said: Hi @gggarl, I have never owned a PVD or DLC treated rep watch, but I used to have a high-quality microbrand watch finished with DLC treatment. Based on my experiences I will provide you with a few suggestions. Baseline - you will find 2 basic types of coating: PVD and DLC. PVD has a matte finishing and DLC shiny - it looks like ceramic. In general, DLC has an opinion of tougher and more resilient one. Having said that, the 1st and probably the most important thing you need to consider is that independently on what type of coating you are gonna go for it will start wearing off sooner or later. Sure, depending on how careful you are, how often you are wearing the watch as well as the quality of the coat on the rep it may sustain more or less abuse but still, eventually you will start seeing the damage. It's the same with gold plated reps - here however it's easier to find a jeweller who can re-plate the watch with a new layer of rose gold - with PVD/DLC once it scratched off you are screwed. The way the wearing off coating will look is in my opinion pretty bad. the base material is stainless steel (silver colour), while the coating is black. What you will start seeing are contrasted silver scratches on the otherwise black surface. It will be visible. The most delicate areas are the edges as well as (especially with the Rolex you are showing above) the clasp. The sticking out crown logo will probably get scratched quite soon. I do understand why you wanna buy a dark watch (I am a fan of this sort of look as well). I wanted to get a DLC Rolex Milgauss a while ago but the reason why I gave up the idea was that I knew that sooner or later the rep will look hideous. If you care about being able to keep your rep looking fresh for years to come but still want a black watch you are left with 2 options: going for full ceramic pieces (as BadApple suggested above) or forged carbon. The main downside is a fairly limited portfolio of choices (and no Rolex reps available). In either case, what you may want to check as an alternative choice are: Ceramic - the VSF Omegas (Planet Ocean 600m & Seamaster Professional 300m), Panerai Ceramica lines, some IWC Pilot models and for real carbon Panerai Carbotech line (Luminor Marina & Submersible) also I guess some versions of Hublot Big Bang. Cheers. @Aramis2288 thanks a lot for the time and the precious informations that you shared above. You touched exact the point i needed to understand: will the scratched PVD or DLC reveal the silvery steel color? The answer as you told and i guess as well is yes, and so i probably wouldnt like the black surface with silver scratches and dents... i shall go ask a business here who is specialized in metal coating and ask them what kind of treatment there are... about other options i must admit right now i am attracted to reps of: Rolex, JLC, Omega not much else...the usual suspects :-) 37 minutes ago, BadApple said: Here is full solid ceramic on a Blancpain Bathyscaphe - it's a dull dark grey. Many factories use DLC and PVD onto steel to get a faux finish be that ceramic or even Titanium. interesting....thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aramis2288 6,133 Posted December 1, 2020 9 minutes ago, gggarl said: The answer as you told and i guess as well is yes, and so i probably wouldnt like the black surface with silver scratches and dents... Here you have a couple of photos showing pretty extensive wear of PVD coating on Breitling Colt: and a bit less damage on Panerai: This is what you can expect over time. Of course, the Breitling above seems extremely abused but I guess you can catch the flow... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gggarl 45 Posted December 1, 2020 @Aramis2288 ughhhh, yes i must change my mind about those coatings... i will look into a standard SS piece then. the wear on the above breitling is the wear i could love on a Sub or GMTII with a leather strap tho. I want to get a perfectly bling Datejust rep for the weekends and a very abused and beaten up Sub rep or GMT II for everyday. Will do my research on the TD sites.... If i dont go wrong there was a GMT with a bakelite bezel right? i wonder how that looks when scratched... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KJ2020 1,463 Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) I take great care of my watches so I don't worry about getting them scratched. This gen 16710 is 30 years old, I am the original owner. It has been all over the world and has not been sheltered in a safe. But neither do I let anything near it other than a shirt sleeve - it has a protective bubble of about 5 inches. I've done that so long that it is now completely effortless and subconscious. I dont let my reps get scratched either. I have 7 FG and TT reps, all of them have protective film on the clasps and 2 links either side. The oldest is 18 months. All of them look brand new. I just cut out the film pieces from leftover cellphone screen material. Recently I bought a PVD Blaken Sub to make a fantasy blue dial Sub. I'm going to put some film on it too. Buy what you like, protect it as best you can. Reps are short term pleasures anyway. Edited December 2, 2020 by KJ2020 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Simonix 8,660 Posted December 2, 2020 Those photos above looks awful (old Breitling and Pam). I had a tag rep in pvd which was about 10 years old, and an ingersoll which was about the same neither of them looked anywhere near that bad. The ingersoll looked brand new, apart from one single scratch. The tag started to wear thin. So not scratched, rather it started to fade to a grey net the edges. It almost looked like patina. these both were worn a lot and had a lot of use. I have therefore found that with a little care, they look fine. Here is a photo of those two watches: 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aramis2288 6,133 Posted December 2, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, KJ2020 said: Buy what you like, protect it as best you can. Reps are short term pleasures anyway. Daaaaaaiimmmm...... it DOES look decent indeed! Wow. Edited December 2, 2020 by Aramis2288 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SteveA 305 Posted December 2, 2020 Only ever bought PVD once it was a Brietling and the coating did scratch and chip,looked like shit very quickly so out it went.I wouldn’t do it if it’s a watch you want to wear daily but if a special occasion type you may get away with it 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gggarl 45 Posted December 2, 2020 Thanks for all the recommendations and advices about my questions. I just came across a Blancpain Fifty Athoms Bathyscaphe Ceramic and indeed could be this material a whole different story. Just this Bathyscaphe it a little too big for me, max size is 40 mm for my wrists... About the taping technique i for sure could try to do it as well, at least on the "sunday" rep, the daily workhorses i like em battered. A question floats now around in my mind @KJ2020 "why are reps a short term pleasure?" what do you mean? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KJ2020 1,463 Posted December 2, 2020 26 minutes ago, gggarl said: Thanks for all the recommendations and advices about my questions. I just came across a Blancpain Fifty Athoms Bathyscaphe Ceramic and indeed could be this material a whole different story. Just this Bathyscaphe it a little too big for me, max size is 40 mm for my wrists... About the taping technique i for sure could try to do it as well, at least on the "sunday" rep, the daily workhorses i like em battered. A question floats now around in my mind @KJ2020 "why are reps a short term pleasure?" what do you mean? Just that many people don't keep them very long compared to a gen. Either they break and you don't want to put more money into a fake watch, or a better version comes along and you want to upgrade. The rep world is a constantly changing environment - some people buy every newer version of a watch that comes out, sometimes from more than one factory. Flipping old stock becomes a habitual act. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadApple 13,079 Posted December 2, 2020 59 minutes ago, gggarl said: Thanks for all the recommendations and advices about my questions. I just came across a Blancpain Fifty Athoms Bathyscaphe Ceramic and indeed could be this material a whole different story. Just this Bathyscaphe it a little too big for me, max size is 40 mm for my wrists... About the taping technique i for sure could try to do it as well, at least on the "sunday" rep, the daily workhorses i like em battered. A question floats now around in my mind @KJ2020 "why are reps a short term pleasure?" what do you mean? The Bathyscaphe is actually 43.5mm but does wear bigger 41mm??? Try IWC Mkxv111 - https://trustytime.io/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=30_191&products_id=18613 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gggarl 45 Posted December 2, 2020 1 hour ago, KJ2020 said: Just that many people don't keep them very long compared to a gen. Either they break and you don't want to put more money into a fake watch, or a better version comes along and you want to upgrade. The rep world is a constantly changing environment - some people buy every newer version of a watch that comes out, sometimes from more than one factory. Flipping old stock becomes a habitual act. Thanks yes i believe i understand, ok. 59 minutes ago, BadApple said: The Bathyscaphe is actually 43.5mm but does wear bigger 41mm??? Try IWC Mkxv111 - https://trustytime.io/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=30_191&products_id=18613 that is a sexy one piece! thanks for letting me know :-D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HAIRlab_DC 6 Posted February 9, 2021 On 02/12/2020 at 00:39, KJ2020 said: "I take great care of my watches so I don't worry about getting them scratched." I No matter how well you take care of your watches, in my experience (gen Black Seal and B&R) scratches and dings that would probably be almost unnoticeable on SS watches tend to stand out on PVD. Not a dealbreaker for me, but a fact nonetheless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites