Q: Any idea what movement is this?

[Vyman 11]

Hi All,

I've been a proud owner of this 312 for years (really thick watch) - 1312 

Anyhow, back to my question: It doesnt get much wrist time now and then i decided to "manually" wind it and the date moves instead. I can retract the crown 1 more time to adjust hour/minute hand.

Any idea if this movement can be manually wound?  Your expert opinion is much appreciate 

This is the VSF superclone v2:  https://trustytime.io/index.php?main_page=product_info&amp;cPath=459&amp;products_id=16397   << should be this exact one but of course I bought it from another TD years back.

Some pictures here:

 

 

 

 

Edited July 31, 2021 by Vyman
wrong image link

[nitocx 49]

Automatic movement accept 3 crown postion: Zero , 1 and 2, from inside to outside.

- Zero position is crown inmediately next to the case.

- 1 position is 1 click pulled out.

-2 position is 2 clicks pulled out.

 

You can wind manually in Zero position moving crown "upwards" and falling a little tiny resistance. Aditionally you can see the gear moving in the case back.

Position 1 is for date changing.

Position 3 is for hand settings.

 

That will work.

 

 

 

 

[FudgyDocker 3,497]

@Vyman Does it have a pusher for the date at 2 o'clock?

 

(forget that - I just description that date changes via crown. I have a rep 1312 that doesn't run right. but it has a pusher at 2:00 for date. No -one can tell me what movement it is. Hours of research and still no closer)

[tribefan 6,768]

32 minutes ago, FudgyDocker said:

@Vyman Does it have a pusher for the date at 2 o'clock?

 

(forget that - I just description that date changes via crown. I have a rep 1312 that doesn't run right. but it has a pusher at 2:00 for date. No -one can tell me what movement it is. Hours of research and still no closer)

I've read some threads on RWI on the clone P9000. On the phone now, I'll check when I get back to my LT.

[NCRich 13,746]

1 hour ago, FudgyDocker said:

@Vyman Does it have a pusher for the date at 2 o'clock?

 

(forget that - I just description that date changes via crown. I have a rep 1312 that doesn't run right. but it has a pusher at 2:00 for date. No -one can tell me what movement it is. Hours of research and still no closer)

I recall you talking about this years ago.  I have an equation of time that has the pusher at 4.  Seems like a pusher at 2 would be in the way of the CG lever.

[FudgyDocker 3,497]

12 hours ago, NCRich said:

I recall you talking about this years ago.  I have an equation of time that has the pusher at 4.  Seems like a pusher at 2 would be in the way of the CG lever.

MIne looks to be a TY2555 variant, but looking at all the different makers of similar movements, not one of them has a pusher at 2:00. It's annoying because it probably just needs a bit of a service. The balance wheel just stops running occasionally, and it can lose between 20 minutes and 4 hours before it starts running again unless you spot it, give it a tap, and it starts going again. Got 3 or 4 watches with little faults on them. I suppose I'll just save them all up and take them to Turkey with me. The watch smiths there will sort them all out.

[GenTLe 1,497]

It's not a movement that requires replacement. There can be just 2 problems there:

1) the stem is too short, hence when you push it all in, it stays in the "date setting" and doesn't go into winding position. Solution: add a stem extender and gradually cut it to the correct lenght

2) messed up keyless, which requires a partial disassemble to fix it

EDIT: adding last thing: as suggested by @nitocx this can happen also if the movement is not properly fixed inside the case. Pushing the stem makes it to move in the opposite direction and the 1st position isn't reached.

[Vyman 11]

17 hours ago, nitocx said:

Automatic movement accept 3 crown postion: Zero , 1 and 2, from inside to outside.

- Zero position is crown inmediately next to the case.

- 1 position is 1 click pulled out.

-2 position is 2 clicks pulled out.

 

You can wind manually in Zero position moving crown "upwards" and falling a little tiny resistance. Aditionally you can see the gear moving in the case back.

Position 1 is for date changing.

Position 3 is for hand settings.

 

That will work.

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately not, I have only 2 positions:

1) Zero position crown next to case (when i wind this upwards, the date changes)

2) 1 position, 1 click pulled out (that adjusts my hand settings)

Please see pictures below 0 and 1 position only

 

17 hours ago, FudgyDocker said:

@Vyman Does it have a pusher for the date at 2 o'clock?

 

(forget that - I just description that date changes via crown. I have a rep 1312 that doesn't run right. but it has a pusher at 2:00 for date. No -one can tell me what movement it is. Hours of research and still no closer)

I can't see anything at the 2 o'clock  without dismantling the whole thing. but there's a tiny gear at the 3 oclock that doesnt seem to move no matter what I do to it (please see picture below)

 

1 hour ago, GenTLe said:

It's not a movement that requires replacement. There can be just 2 problems there:

1) the stem is too short, hence when you push it all in, it stays in the "date setting" and doesn't go into winding position. Solution: add a stem extender and gradually cut it to the correct lenght

2) messed up keyless, which requires a partial disassemble to fix it

You might be right on point 1? I'm no expert, anyone know of any reliable guy here in SG that can help me look into it.

 

 

[FudgyDocker 3,497]

1 hour ago, Vyman said:

I can't see anything at the 2 o'clock  without dismantling the whole thing

If you had a pusher at 2pm, it would be behind the lever of the crown guard, built into the CG.

[GenTLe 1,497]

1 hour ago, Vyman said:

Unfortunately not, I have only 2 positions:

1) Zero position crown next to case (when i wind this upwards, the date changes)

2) 1 position, 1 click pulled out (that adjusts my hand settings)

Please see pictures below 0 and 1 position only

Mate, I don't care about pictures. If the stem is too short you'll never reach the 1st position, but it's there. For sure. You're always into 2nd and 3rd one. It's a defect, not a design feature. No movement has the stem into setting position (date or time) all the time. Even the Seiko 7s26/7s36 base movements, which don't have hand winding, have the 1st position, and 1st is for date and 2nd is for time.
And yes, also the ones with lateral pusher to set date, has a 1st position.

[nitocx 49]

Stem too short or a woobling movement...

 

 

[FudgyDocker 3,497]

20 hours ago, NCRich said:

Seems like a pusher at 2 would be in the way of the CG lever.

Here you go, @NCRich - pusher at 2, no CG issues

[NCRich 13,746]

22 minutes ago, FudgyDocker said:

Here you go, @NCRich - pusher at 2, no CG issues

Yes, except for the hole they had to drill for it.  I haven't had one like that.  Interesting.

[Junior88 387]

26 minutes ago, FudgyDocker said:

Here you go, @NCRich - pusher at 2, no CG issues

I have a PAM just like this with a pusher underneath the CG. For the date wheel. 

[tribefan 6,768]

42 minutes ago, Junior88 said:

I have a PAM just like this with a pusher underneath the CG. For the date wheel. 

Take a pic of the movement.

[Junior88 387]

1 hour ago, tribefan said:

Take a pic of the movement.

 

 

 

 

[Vyman 11]

On 02/08/2021 at 00:04, GenTLe said:

Mate, I don't care about pictures. If the stem is too short you'll never reach the 1st position, but it's there. For sure. You're always into 2nd and 3rd one. It's a defect, not a design feature. No movement has the stem into setting position (date or time) all the time. Even the Seiko 7s26/7s36 base movements, which don't have hand winding, have the 1st position, and 1st is for date and 2nd is for time.
And yes, also the ones with lateral pusher to set date, has a 1st position.

Got it. Thanks.

 

On 02/08/2021 at 02:21, FudgyDocker said:

Here you go, @NCRich - pusher at 2, no CG issues

Nah - i dont have a pusher on mine. Just the screw for the crown protector.