seclark007 11 Posted October 30, 2012 Jorge, When you served your country, you gave up a good number of your individual rights and subordinated yourself to the government, as the military does not serve it's own purposes - it responds to the mandate given to it by the public. The retoric you spew is at odds with you purport to advocate. You gave up your freedom when you volunteered to enlist to provide the very safety and security that you enjoy as a citizen...governments by themselves are neither good or bad...it is the voice of the people in action. It's been said that every democratic country deserves the government that it votes for. When less than 50% of the population exercises it's democratic right to cast a vote due to apathy...I call that lazyness. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mazz 62 Posted October 30, 2012 Jorge, When you served your country, you gave up a good number of your individual rights and subordinated yourself to the government, as the military does not serve it's own purposes - it responds to the mandate given to it by the public. The retoric you spew is at odds with you purport to advocate. You gave up your freedom when you volunteered to enlist to provide the very safety and security that you enjoy as a citizen...governments by themselves are neither good or bad...it is the voice of the people in action. It's been said that every democratic country deserves the government that it votes for. When less than 50% of the population exercises it's democratic right to cast a vote due to apathy...I call that lazyness. +1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luthier 1 Posted October 30, 2012 +1, Whore!!! You can take my freedoms from my dead hands only, together with my hot gun. Thanks Founding Fathers for 2nd Amendment!!! Why can't we have security AND freedoms at the same time??? Sister, I'm naturalized too, and I do love this country, but no way I'll ever give up any of my freedoms. I spilled out my blood for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jorge-(WhoreHay) 261 Posted October 30, 2012 When I was in the military, I lived by a different set of rules: orders had to be followed and were not up for debate. There was a clear chain of command. My constitutional rights were restricted with my consent. I am now a civilian. The Constitution and the Bill of Rights are the basis for those of us in the civilian world. Try to go take a flight these days. Your Fourth Ammendment right is being trampled left and right and people just take it without question. That's how far down the drain we've descended. But, other than that (and a few other Constitutional hiccups), this is still the best form of government devised by humans... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RichardMiami 4 Posted October 30, 2012 Amendment IV The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. 1. you have no "right" to ride an airplane 2. what is "unreasonable" about guaranteeing safety on an airplane? I have a right to expect my government to protect me from airplane hijackers. They do. It is not perfect, but it works. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mazz 62 Posted October 30, 2012 Amendment IV The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. 1. you have no "right" to ride an airplane 2. what is "unreasonable" about guaranteeing safety on an airplane? I have a right to expect my government to protect me from airplane hijackers. They do. It is not perfect, but it works. Absolutely Well said. Take Greyhound or your car if you don't like it cause you have that choice. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RichardMiami 4 Posted October 30, 2012 I wonder if Jorge knows where this position is quoted from: November 17, 2010 Airport security has been a major focus of security efforts since 9/11, and rightly so. However, the government's approach to keeping our skies safe has often been marked by an unfortunate focus on high-tech gimmicks and identity-based security — and, more recently, highly invasive pat-downs — that not only threaten American values but also fall short as an effective way to secure aviation. The government should enact procedures that pose the least threat to our civil liberties and are also proven to be effective. Routine full body scanning, embarrassingly intimate pat-downs and racial profiling do not fit those criteria. The government must act quickly to take all reasonable steps to close any holes in our security, but it must also act wisely and in a manner consistent with our values. http://www.aclu.org/technology-and-liberty/airport-security Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diplosa 0 Posted October 30, 2012 Wtf is this old thread. Who resurrected it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jorge-(WhoreHay) 261 Posted October 30, 2012 Richard/Mazz, you are correct... I have no right to ride on an airplane... However, it is not the Federal Government's job to guarantee my safety on an airplane. It is the airline's. After all, it is their plane that could be used as a weapon. But that is too complex an issue to address here. So, what should the role of goverment be? Mmmm... If the role of government is to guarantee my safety during an airplane ride, why not also my health? What about guaranteeing me the right to not die of lung cancer? Or that I will not develop diabetes. How about guaranteeing me that I will have a job until I reach retirement? Or that I will not run out of money during my retirement? How far do you want to take the role of government in your life? Almost anything the government does, the private sector can do it better, cheaper, more effectively. And if the market for safe flights is there, people will choose those airlines with better safety records, than those with shoddy safety records. Pile on, now... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trailboss99 996 Posted October 30, 2012 When I was in the military, I lived by a different set of rules: orders had to be followed and were not up for debate. There was a clear chain of command. My constitutional rights were restricted with my consent. I am now a civilian. The Constitution and the Bill of Rights are the basis for those of us in the civilian world. Try to go take a flight these days. Your Fourth Ammendment right is being trampled left and right and people just take it without question. That's how far down the drain we've descended. But, other than that (and a few other Constitutional hiccups), this is still the best form of government devised by humans... Did you not make a promise to obey the laws of the land when you became a citizen? Yes, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights are the basis of the law s of the land but they are not the laws themselves. In OZ we have saying for people like you. If you don't like it, leave. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gB. 0 Posted October 30, 2012 Did you not make a promise to obey the laws of the land when you became a citizen? Yes, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights are the basis of the law s of the land but they are not the laws themselves. In OZ we have saying for people like you. If you don't like it, leave. +1. BTW, what happened to Jorge? Is/Was he in the Gulag slammer? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RichardMiami 4 Posted October 30, 2012 The words Lest we forget come into play Jorge. Just a reminder for you -- on Sept 11, 2001 the airlines (private sector) did such a good job of providing security that FOUR aircraft we hijacked at once and guided by terrorists. One flew into 1 World Trade Center, one flew into 2 World Trade Center. Both towers collapsed killing over 3,000 innocent people. A third plane hit the Pentagon and fourth was headed for the White House when the passengers overpowered the terrorists and crashed the plane rather then letting it be used as a bomb. Hundreds died. One of the changes that came out of this was the Federal takeover of airline security. Lest you think I am some kind of armchair internet expert, please consider thatb I am typing this from a Gate at MIA waiting for a plane. I am insulted that I should have to remind an American of this. Read your history young man. Sent from my DROID3 using Tapatalk 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadmeat 0 Posted October 30, 2012 Monitor this! +10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 And then plus some more. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
