KW strikes again!–KW PAM505 & PAM388–Maybe the best Radiomir ever built

[ALE7575 24]

ALE, please, compare KW505 and TS505.

 

I have at this moment my KW PAM 505 and a TSW PAM 505 sent to me by courtesy of Mark in order to make the review

 

I'm at this moment preparing it

I have taken almost all pics and data to start

The complete comparison will be ready (I hope)in max. two-three weeks

 

 

Wait a little please, but I almost know at this moment which is the winner.

 

ALE

Edited March 13, 2014 by ALE7575

[sergiiko 1]

Thank you, very much, ALE. Will you start a new thread for that comparison?

[ALE7575 24]

Thank you, very much, ALE. Will you start a new thread for that comparison?

 

Yes. Of course. There will be a new review thread.

In two-three weeks depending on work and free time

ALE

Edited March 14, 2014 by ALE7575

[fana05 0]

Ale, thanks for this. How would you rate the long-term outlook on durability of the wire lugs (once properly secured with loctite)? Any risk they may snap?

[ALE7575 24]

Ale, thanks for this. How would you rate the long-term outlook on durability of the wire lugs (once properly secured with loctite)? Any risk they may snap?

 

The main problems are not broken lugs wires. They are:

- Screws impossible to remove due to damaged thread

- Screws not tightening the lug wires (therefore loosened lugs)

- Damaged case thread, much less frequent

 

In TSW-ZFac version the lugs are fitted with a rubber sleeve in the tip to introduce in the case and the screw are fitted with a rubber O-ring which allows better fitting lug wires-case and better tightening of wires. O-rings assure the locking of the screws

In KW V1 are the main problems included

In KW V2 Kuvarsit has included metallic sleeves and the results are good enough. No O-rings included but you can buy them from Panatime

 

Loctite is a way to assure completely the locking of the screws, but just medium lock Loctite 222 or 243 type and only a bit in the thread

 

ALE

[wiremonkey 0]

hi guys.

 

just purchased a Pam 505 still waiting for it actually from a dealer. Wanted to do some strap shopping and chanced upon this.

 

 

How is the Pam 505 KW V2 strap change? Is it still a nightmare or should I give it ago?

 

I dont want to ruin it even before I put that beast on my wrist...

 

thanks for the advice!

[mysterio 18]

Issues with the lugs on Radiomirs have been identified and fixed as early as the V1 of the 505 (the version change was not due to the lug wires). You should have no problems using it. If you want the lugs to remain extra fixed, put a tiny drop of threadlocker on the thread of the screw (the Loctite model escapes me as I don't use it on my x88s (288 and 388)) .

[wiremonkey 0]

Issues with the lugs on Radiomirs have been identified and fixed as early as the V1 of the 505 (the version change was not due to the lug wires). You should have no problems using it. If you want the lugs to remain extra fixed, put a tiny drop of threadlocker on the thread of the screw (the Loctite model escapes me as I don't use it on my x88s (288 and 388)) .

 

Thanks mysterio. Appreciate your response and advice mate

[dcsharp 0]

I spent around 5 Hours last night drooling over PAMs on various TDs websites, reading your info and other forum posts. Somehow I've only just noticed this thread.... Man oh man that 505 is amazing!

 

Anyway just a quick thanks, your information is absolutely incredible. Thank you very much.

[HeavyKrush 32]

I've owned both of these gems. Sold the 505 but still have the 388. Swapped the rep gator strap for real lizard and it tends to be my go to dress watch next to my Seiko cocktail time. Have swapped straps many times with no issues also.

 

[chrish8 0]

ale now you made me want the 505

[ryanvan01 0]

How long did it take to get after you ordered?

[JohnPilot 11]

I like the look anbd build quality of these.

What I don't like that some parts that should be moving on a working movement are not. So it looks a bit ridiculous when someone wants to see the backside of the running watch.

[HeavyKrush 32]

Ryan, purchased mine M2M.

 

John, what's not moving that should be?

[ALE7575 24]

I spent around 5 Hours last night drooling over PAMs on various TDs websites, reading your info and other forum posts. Somehow I've only just noticed this thread.... Man oh man that 505 is amazing!

 

Anyway just a quick thanks, your information is absolutely incredible. Thank you very much.

 

To get more info about all PAM reps read:

"Reference PAM REVIEW-GUIDE" - Replica Search, Identification, Evaluation & Selection

http://www.replica-watch.info/vb/showthread.php/reference-pam-review-107365.html?t=107365

 

ALE

[JMMC 0]

>> also know that KW PAM 505 is not, obviously, made of Composite, but the KW beadblasted and DLC coated SS has such a quality that you will forget the material.<<

 

May be even better :-)

You´ll have to read on reputeted gen forums, what happened to the ultraexpensive composite case, when someone poured accidentaly gintonic (not sulfuric acid) on it.

 

Some people still thinks the "rep" was the "gin", that time. lol

[JohnPilot 11]

Ryan, purchased mine M2M.

 

John, what's not moving that should be?

 

Its the little fake gearwheel near the balance wheel.

[wiremonkey 0]

Hi guys...

 

I just got my pam505

 

I noticed at the sides of my seconds hand. Its suppose to be full black (excluding the lume). Mine has white patches on the side which makes it look like a rep lol

Was wondering if anybody else have that issue?

 

Mine is a kw v2 seagull btw

 

Thanks in advance!

[mosa786 2]

These look stunning!

[mrbobdobalina 0]

PAM 388 Looks great! Another one added to "The List"

[Omar Alberto Mera 0]

Thanks for sharing the info, enjoy it!!

[Thrasher 135]

I bought a KW 388 V2 on M2M over at RWI a month ago and love it, really great looking watch and my first radiomir, I think the strap is KW original black croc and for a rep strap that was the biggest surprise that it fit my 8.25 inch wrist fine and looks so good. The only thing I worry about is the crown threading up right as it doesn't catch right away but that seems to be one of my major complaints with reps, crowns and tubes.

 

I'm kinda of afraid of the PVD or DLC watches as I just don't trust the finish.

[strozzi 1]

Heavy Krush, were'd you get that lizard strap? Looks terrific!

[Melonas 0]

KW strikes again! – KW PAM505 & PAM388 – Maybe the best Radiomir ever built

 

I received two weeks ago KW PAM 505 and PAM 388 from Kuvarsit.

I have worn for a week KW PAM 505 and another week KW PAM 388

They were two weeks of enjoying these watches and getting compliments.

These two watches are something different. They are even better made than KW PAM Boutique or PAM 312.

 

 

 

Yes, I know they have a display caseback and you can realize that the movement is not a P.9000.

The sapphire caseback crystal allows to see a Seagull ST2555 movement, 26 jewels 21.600 b.p.h, with rotor and bridges decorated almost with the same quality of the gen. This Seagull is so nicely decorated and having the balance wheel @6 (near to @7 like gen) sometimes you are thinking it is PAM movement. Besides, the nice darkened caseback crystal in PAM 505 helps to hide it is a rep.

These are the best PAM decorated movements I have seen.

 

 

 

I also know that KW PAM 505 is not, obviously, made of Composite, but the KW beadblasted and DLC coated SS has such a quality that you will forget the material. Leaving aside the weight you will realize that you are in front of a material that does not at all seem SS. I think that beadblasting process is no stranger to this success.

The case of KW PAM 505 has a smooth touch, it is like…“warm”, the uniformity of the surface is awesome and you will not find any flaw on it. The colour changes from black to a brown depending on light conditions. I would call this colour “warm” black. Nothing about red or green reflects that people were talking about. You will get impressed with the beauty of this colour.

 

 

 

PAM 388

The first time you see this watch you will notice the same that when you see a KW PAM Boutique or a KW PAM 312, you will think it is a gen.

The finish of the polished SS case surface is another step in rep quality. You will not find any flaw, lack of uniformity or warped zones. Edges are well defined and sharp.

The crown has a logo perfectly engraved, even under the lens.

 

 

Caseback is the same as the rest of the case, no lack of care, it is the same finish that you have in the front case and the engravings are crisp and deep like gen.

 

 

The dial of this watch, although it has date window and seconds subdial @9 is simple and smart. It features a nice almost matt warm black surface and the cuts for sandwich markers are very well finished (no flaws). The quality of dial surface finish is achieved through a microblasted treatment

Lume is first quality and has a nice greenish colour

You can see this slight greenish colour even on the light, and it contrast nicely with the creamish colour of RADIOMIR BLACKSEAL – PANERAI inscriptions on dial. These inscriptions are raised and almost matt like gen. The quality of inscriptions is perfect even under the lens. Date wheel fonts are a bit smaller than gen and are raised and creamish matching other inscriptions

This slight greenish lume colour contrasting with creamish inscriptions seems to be a trend on new series of Panerais, this fashion has a very strong personality and the look is really nice (you can even see it in the new Submersible PAM 389).

Cannon pinion end is well placed and perfectly polished like gen

Hands have good finish but lume is clearly wider than gen.

Crystal is high quality sapphire AR coated colourless following Swiss Standards like gen

The only warning for this case are the screws to fix the lug wires to hold the strap. Usually radiomirs are very delicate at this regard, but KW 505 and 388 need specially care regarding these screws. You have to use a good quality watchsmith screwdriver of 1,6mm and be careful with the alignment between screw and screwdriver, pushing gently the screw when you are loosening or tightening them.

 

 

The rep strap has a good quality and the creamish stitching, matching the colour of inscriptions, looks really beautiful. Of course this watch deserves a better quality of strap, but you will be able living some time with rep strap without problems.

Buckle is also well finished as the case but the engraving is less deep than gen

 

 

 

PAM 505

Maybe, this is one of the best built replicas I have seen.

First time I saw the KW PAM 505 I didn’t believe the overall quality and finish of this watch. Even under the watchsmith lens you will get impressed by the quality of KW DLC surface and colour. I honestly cannot imagine that the gen can be better finished.

As above commented even the touch is perfect. I was very reluctant about these DLC coatings to replicate Composite or Ceramic materials. But seeing PAM 505 I had to change of opinion. We can get a real Composite or Ceramic appearance with a good beadblasting of the SS surface and a good quality DLC coating. And KW got it.

This watch is a different concept in rep quality. Please ask owners for their opinion. I have the same comments as PAM 388: you will not find any flaw, lack of uniformity or warped zones. Edges are well defined and sharp. The crown has a logo perfectly engraved, even under the lens.

 

 

Caseback is the same as the rest of the case, no lack of care, it is the same finish that you have in the front case and the engravings are crisp and deep like gen.

 

 

As above commented PAM 505 is fitted with a beautiful darkened caseback crystal which matches with the dark overall colour of the watch and helps to hide the rep movement, almost like a solid caseback.

 

 

The dial of this watch, although it gets date window and seconds subdial @9 is simple and smart. It features a nice almost matt brown surface, the same colour as the case, and the cuts for sandwich markers are very well finished (no flaws). The quality of dial surface finish is achieved through a microblasted treatment

Lume have a nice vintage creamish colour, but maybe due to that is weaker than PAM 388 lume

In PAM 505 dial there are no contrasts: dial surface is almost matt brown, all the rest: inscriptions, date wheel fonts and markers lume are vintage creamish. RADIOMIR BLACK SEAL – PANERAI inscriptions are raised and almost matt like gen. The quality of inscriptions is perfect even under the lens. Date wheel fonts are a bit smaller than gen and are raised and creamish matching other inscriptions.

This lack of contrasts gives to PAM 505 an interesting and smart look, sporty but also classy, full of personality.

Cannon pinion end is well placed and perfectly polished like gen

Hands have good finish but lume is clearly wider than gen.

Crystal is high quality sapphire AR coated colourless following Swiss Standards like gen

As in Pam 388, the only warning of this case are the screws to fix the lug wires to hold the strap. Usually Radiomirs are very delicate at this regard, but KW 505 and 388 need specially care regarding these screws. You have to use a good quality watchsmith screwdriver of 1,6mm and be careful with the alignment between screw and screwdriver, pushing gently the screw when you are loosening or tightening them.

 

 

The magnificent Asso rep strap has a very good quality and the stitching is even darker than lume and inscriptions, matching gen stitching colour of the gen 505 bought by Mehmet.

Buckle is also nicely DLC coated like the case but the engraving is less deep than gen. Gen PAM 505 buckle has a different hole shape to shelter the fixation screw which is carefully respected by the replica (nice detail).

 

 

With these two watches KW has achieved the gen finish and the accuracy together. Leaving aside the movement and the difference of material in PAM 505 we really have two Super reps.

But following our current evaluation criteria, since these watches have display caseback and you can tell the rep movement, we must evaluate them as First Class reps bordering the Super rep status. Bearing in mind that the rest of the watch is a complete Super replica.

As said in the title, Kuvarsit srikes again and has released the best built Radiomirs ever seen

 

Thanks for reading

ALE

wow ale you are great! Do you know where I can find the best radiomir NOW available ? 42mm

 

Cheers

[Hasat 0]

Hi ALE7575

 

Any suggestions for me?