Why can't people just use the Trusted Dealers???

[Baldrick 1]

If you have to ask, you don't know

[vonGluberschmidt 0]

just restating the obvious....

 

Mary send pics of the actual watch you will be getting in the mail. Not many offer this service.

and not all reps can be obtained by every dealer... so you go with your main supplier, and if they can't fulfill your request, then you can see if the other dealers can.

 

plain and simple.

 

we all learned.... some painfully expensive lessons and thankfully others just got great watches with great service at great prices.

 

[Akira 0]

If you have to ask, you don't know

 

Guilty I am then....

[Balad1 0]

If you have to ask, you don't know

 

Guilty I am then....

 

It's not you Akira, he's being his normal asshole self.

[Scavolas 0]

Hmm, interesting arguments revolving around some simple notions. I guess I see the point of both sides.

 

Trusted dealers are family for those who made deals with them in the past, who actually invited them to become trusted, hence, there is a minority on the forum, who actually trust the trusted dealers.

Noobs, like me or anyone new here come here after some window-shopping at probably scam sites, with or without a fair judgement and the knowledge of the ins-and-outs of the rep world, especially scam sites.

 

Seeing a rep site with 500-1000 rep models with descriptions and fairly good photos and a improved-looking, instant online customer service does not deter (and honestly why would?) anybody from going forward with ordering (that is why they design it so!).

 

If someone is not into Pam, Rolex or Omega, the so-called mainstream of the rep world and for some stupid selfish personal reason, has a wishlist of reps that is seemingly available in scam sites but not even mentioned on trusted sites, how would anyone come to the idea about start soliciting dealers about that specific model? (Mary is exception of the exceptionals, I mean all the others) Most of any dealers want to sell what they have in stock and not (always) to entertain some foolish noob's personal petproject. At least this is the perceived way from a noob perspective.

 

Believe me guys, when you are a noob and you do not have the 'trust', by personal experience you do not see much of a difference between A and B dealer. At that point of the learning curve it takes a lot of faith or whatever you would call that (wisdom?) to believe without much proof. And since it is usually some serious money is involved, the psychology of the situation is truly bad.

[Scavolas 0]

For example, I arrived here with the idea of buying my first rep of my life, a Corum Admirals Cup Chrono with A7750 mvmt after looking at at least 2 dozens of sites WITHOUT ever stumbling into ANY of the trusted dealers here. Already had a good idea about what versions with what kind of shortcomings are available (at least by pictures!) and came here with an open mind with a honest urge to learn. I read literally the WHOLE General discussion (no kidding!) and checked out ALL the trusted dealers, only to see that NONE of them carried exactly what I needed. I have the UK transshipment necessity and want to use Paypal if possible, or MasterCard payment. I approached one of the trusted dealers and recieved some weird answer stating that that particular model DOES NOT EXIST in A7750 version. Period. Which is, of course a slip of the mind. So what do you do when you are a noob and get a definitive, authorative bullshit like that? Of course you can do two things: you go with another dealer or forgo with the chosen rep model altogether. Blame will always be on yourself, whatever you make.

 

I chose another model at another dealer. Go figure... =))

[Balad1 0]

Hmm, interesting arguments revolving around some simple notions. I guess I see the point of both sides.

 

Trusted dealers are family for those who made deals with them in the past, who actually invited them to become trusted, hence, there is a minority on the forum, who actually trust the trusted dealers.

Noobs, like me or anyone new here come here after some window-shopping at probably scam sites, with or without a fair judgement and the knowledge of the ins-and-outs of the rep world, especially scam sites.

 

Seeing a rep site with 500-1000 rep models with descriptions and fairly good photos and a improved-looking, instant online customer service does not deter (and honestly why would?) anybody from going forward with ordering (that is why they design it so!).

 

If someone is not into Pam, Rolex or Omega, the so-called mainstream of the rep world and for some stupid selfish personal reason, has a wishlist of reps that is seemingly available in scam sites but not even mentioned on trusted sites, how would anyone come to the idea about start soliciting dealers about that specific model? (Mary is exception of the exceptionals, I mean all the others) Most of any dealers want to sell what they have in stock and not (always) to entertain some foolish noob's personal petproject. At least this is the perceived way from a noob perspective.

 

Believe me guys, when you are a noob and you do not have the 'trust', by personal experience you do not see much of a difference between A and B dealer. At that point of the learning curve it takes a lot of faith or whatever you would call that (wisdom?) to believe without much proof. And since it is usually some serious money is involved, the psychology of the situation is truly bad.

 

We've all been there at one time, it's just some don't remember or want too.

 

One of the great things about RWG is the kindness and help that most members offer noobs.

 

Anyone who wants to be critical of noobs should go hang out on one of the forums that specialize in flaming new members.

[gtwc 1]

Okay, you ask for the 'Official' standpoint, so here it is (although much of this is said on the Trusted Dealer List).

 

We don't have a relationship with Josh and Andrew, so can't help if things should go wrong. As it says on the Trusted List, the dealers we invite to have subforums are here because we genuinely believe that they are the best around. Most of the dealers that you see elsewhere would be glad to be here, but we are VERY particular about who we actually invite, which means that we have rejected several dealer requests for a sales area here.

 

Having said that, few of our forum dealers have extensive websites and we recognise that some people prefer to buy that way. Josh and Andrew have probably the best rep websites around, which is why we recommend them as an alternative. They can be a little more expensive than some, but they're easy to deal with and reliable. FWIW I've bought from both of them personally.

 

many thanks for an honest & thought-out answer, Greg, appreciate it.

let's hope that Andrew can fulfil his order of mine ......still waiting patiently..

[gtwc 1]

Hmm, interesting arguments revolving around some simple notions. I guess I see the point of both sides.

 

Trusted dealers are family for those who made deals with them in the past, who actually invited them to become trusted, hence, there is a minority on the forum, who actually trust the trusted dealers.

Noobs, like me or anyone new here come here after some window-shopping at probably scam sites, with or without a fair judgement and the knowledge of the ins-and-outs of the rep world, especially scam sites.

 

Seeing a rep site with 500-1000 rep models with descriptions and fairly good photos and a improved-looking, instant online customer service does not deter (and honestly why would?) anybody from going forward with ordering (that is why they design it so!).

 

If someone is not into Pam, Rolex or Omega, the so-called mainstream of the rep world and for some stupid selfish personal reason, has a wishlist of reps that is seemingly available in scam sites but not even mentioned on trusted sites, how would anyone come to the idea about start soliciting dealers about that specific model? (Mary is exception of the exceptionals, I mean all the others) Most of any dealers want to sell what they have in stock and not (always) to entertain some foolish noob's personal petproject. At least this is the perceived way from a noob perspective.

 

Believe me guys, when you are a noob and you do not have the 'trust', by personal experience you do not see much of a difference between A and B dealer. At that point of the learning curve it takes a lot of faith or whatever you would call that (wisdom?) to believe without much proof. And since it is usually some serious money is involved, the psychology of the situation is truly bad.

 

We've all been there at one time, it's just some don't remember or want too.

 

One of the great things about RWG is the kindness and help that most members offer noobs.

 

Anyone who wants to be critical of noobs should go hang out on one of the forums that specialize in flaming new members.

 

 

Hmm, interesting arguments revolving around some simple notions. I guess I see the point of both sides.

 

Trusted dealers are family for those who made deals with them in the past, who actually invited them to become trusted, hence, there is a minority on the forum, who actually trust the trusted dealers.

Noobs, like me or anyone new here come here after some window-shopping at probably scam sites, with or without a fair judgement and the knowledge of the ins-and-outs of the rep world, especially scam sites.

 

Seeing a rep site with 500-1000 rep models with descriptions and fairly good photos and a improved-looking, instant online customer service does not deter (and honestly why would?) anybody from going forward with ordering (that is why they design it so!).

 

If someone is not into Pam, Rolex or Omega, the so-called mainstream of the rep world and for some stupid selfish personal reason, has a wishlist of reps that is seemingly available in scam sites but not even mentioned on trusted sites, how would anyone come to the idea about start soliciting dealers about that specific model? (Mary is exception of the exceptionals, I mean all the others) Most of any dealers want to sell what they have in stock and not (always) to entertain some foolish noob's personal petproject. At least this is the perceived way from a noob perspective.

 

Believe me guys, when you are a noob and you do not have the 'trust', by personal experience you do not see much of a difference between A and B dealer. At that point of the learning curve it takes a lot of faith or whatever you would call that (wisdom?) to believe without much proof. And since it is usually some serious money is involved, the psychology of the situation is truly bad.

 

We've all been there at one time, it's just some don't remember or want too.

 

One of the great things about RWG is the kindness and help that most members offer noobs.

 

Anyone who wants to be critical of noobs should go hang out on one of the forums that specialize in flaming new members.

well said Balad, +1000

[alvinado 0]

because they like to get ripped..

 

and they are curious.

[JohnG 41]

Well I am going to have to be the one to state the obvious. Every single dealer, at one time, was not "trusted." They were just another internet dealer of fake watches, until someone took a chance, and then shared their experience.

 

Just in the three years I have been in this game there have been more dealers added to the trusted dealers lists of the several rep forums than I have fingers and toes, and in that same time, quite a few "trusted" dealers have gone south, sometimes taking a bit of members' money with them.

[Del 4,463]

The thing is, when you are a noob (and I still consider myself one), using Trusted Dealers gives better protection due to the support available from RWG Admin if things go wrong. For those more experienced, I'm sure it is a bit easier to stray off the beaten path and use other dealers, perhaps even new dealers, because you know better what to ask and look for.

 

I still maintain that unless you are very sure of what you are buying, and from whom, then you should stick with the Trusted Dealers.

[Scavolas 0]

The thing is, when you are a noob (and I still consider myself one), using Trusted Dealers gives better protection due to the support available from RWG Admin if things go wrong. For those more experienced, I'm sure it is a bit easier to stray off the beaten path and use other dealers, perhaps even new dealers, because you know better what to ask and look for.

 

I still maintain that unless you are very sure of what you are buying, and from whom, then you should stick with the Trusted Dealers.

 

... and, if you are lucky enough, you can still get what you originally planned to, at the same price with a little bit more confidence and better sleep @night.

[JohnG 41]

If you are a noob I would buy from the trusted dealers list. I buy from the trusted dealers list, though I have bought quite a few watches from other dealers as well. I bought a lot of watches from Getat and Jackson when as far as I know, no other members had, or if they had they hadn't written any reviews.

 

I would also always buy from trusted dealers if you have a low tolerance for risk.

 

But it isn't true that you can get ANYTHING from the trusted dealers. I found a 51mm Oris Prodiver Rep from an unknown dealer. Currently the only one you can get from the trusted dealers is a 45mm version which is really just a reworked Carlos Coste. Will I buy it? I don't know, the safe play would be to wait until the trusted dealers have it.

 

I also know a dealer who beats all the trusted dealer by a good margin for a number of Pams, including the Mare Nostrum which interests me. Will I buy? Probably, sooner or later.

 

A lot of dealers will sell for less when they are unknown because they have no reputation to trade on. Look at Mary, she used to be a lot cheaper than the cartel, now, not so much. Sometimes she is actually MORE expensive.

 

I think, in the end, just use common sense. If you are new, don't know the rep inside out, or just have a low tolerance for risk, buy from known dealers. And don't be stupid and send money by WU or Moneygram to unknown dealers. Always use PayPal - a dealer who accepts PayPal is not likely to fuck you - you have a pretty big hammer over his head if he is selling reps and accepting PP payments.

[Balad1 0]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

[pollux1 3]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

Right balad, you're a good guy, certainly someone I would trust to ask a question and get an honest answer so I reckon you should write a "noob guide"

 

 

 

[Balad1 0]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

Right balad, you're a good guy, certainly someone I would trust to ask a question and get an honest answer so I reckon you should write a "noob guide"

 

Touche good point, and if I could stay focused long enough on one task a worthy cause.

 

On the other hand I believe there already are plenty of well written guides and advice. Being noobs most won't read them and will continue to ask the same old questions.

 

PS: Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.

[pollux1 3]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

Right balad, you're a good guy, certainly someone I would trust to ask a question and get an honest answer so I reckon you should write a "noob guide"

 

Touche good point, and if I could stay focused long enough on one task a worthy cause.

 

On the other hand I believe there already are plenty of well written guides and advice. Being noobs most won't read them and will continue to ask the same old questions.

 

PS: Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.

Noobs and children are ok but old people and puppies? Sheesh!

[Balad1 0]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

Right balad, you're a good guy, certainly someone I would trust to ask a question and get an honest answer so I reckon you should write a "noob guide"

 

Touche good point, and if I could stay focused long enough on one task a worthy cause.

 

On the other hand I believe there already are plenty of well written guides and advice. Being noobs most won't read them and will continue to ask the same old questions.

 

PS: Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.

 

Noobs and children are ok but old people and puppies? Sheesh!

 

I was trying to be a politician and cover all my bases, lol.

[Luthier 1]

Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.[/b]

 

Women... No?

[Balad1 0]

Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.[/b]

 

Women... No?

 

Thank you for reminding me Luthier, women with nice boobs...

[JohnG 41]

Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.[/b]

 

Women... No?

He's got a hard spot for them.

[Balad1 0]

Actually I'm not a good guy but do have a soft spot for noobs, children, old people and puppies, lol.[/b]

 

Women... No?

He's got a hard spot for them.

 

[50 Fathoms 0]

I think we're all in agreement that using trusted dealers is the only way to go if at all possible.

 

My peeve and point being that a select few of our members tend to be rather impatient with noobs when they ask about scam site "xyz", "who makes the best sub" or “express a foolish noob opinionâ€.

 

Personally I think that if you can’t post something positive or informative in reply to a noob then don’t post anything at all.

 

If you think what I’m claiming doesn’t happen read this thread again.

 

Balad1, Thanks for showing a little compassion towards the many people who are drawn to this great site but take a while to absorb all the info in one visit. I learn something from each visit and love the verbal exchanges with some of the NOOB slapping being deserved and some a little on the harsh side but that's how we learn. However, I have just been shafted and thought I would share a little of the experience to show how easy it is to be sucked in.

 

This is my grail watch and I have been looking for a good auto rep for months.

 

I had checked every TD and could not find the exact one I wanted (vintage - yes, quartz - yes but not my grail). I emailed Mary with pictures and she could not find one. Now we all know the longer you can't find one the more you crave. It's human nature and even the Senior members will feel the same.

I eventually found the exact watch on the REPLICA-SWISS.COM site (Scamming bastards!!). After a few emails about quality, movement, etc., which were promptly answered, they sent me pics of the 'exact' watch I would receive.

 

 

Bingo! I can get one. I gullibly paid my $199 and waited for the postman. 2 weeks later this crock of shit arrived.....!!!

 

If the photos don't do it justice, believe me this is the worst item I have ever purchased. It feels like a metal toy watch without the quality.

 

I sent a mail back stating the obvious flaws.

 

Please note the following mistakes compared to YOUR photographs:

1. Bezel should be ceramic, curved with green luminous diving minute numbers and markers. Your watch has a flat bezel with no lumious numbers and is cheaply printed.

2. The date should be black background with white numbers. Your watch is the opposite.

3. Hour markers should be green luminous. Your watch has very poor BLACK markers.

4. The hands should be different shape with green luminous coating. The pointers are not the same as your photo with cheap white lume.

5. I believe the winder should be the screw in type.

6. There is no Blancpain engraving on the side of case opposite winder. See your photos

7. The movement is noisy and rattles which is a sign of a very cheap movement. Normal Asian or Chinese Seagull movements are much better than this.

8 Finally, The strap is very, very cheap plastic. Like those found on children's toy watches.

 

I demanded a full refund and to return the watch.

They proposed to me to keep the watch and choose any watch from their site for a further $150!

Refraining from launching into a full 'Fuck Off' tirade, I proposed a full refund and a watch return as this watch would never be worn.

They suggested $50 refund and I keep the watch.

I responded with give me the full amount NOW!

They suggested $100 and I keep the watch.

I offered some compromise of $150 minimum and no refund (saving the postage) or the full refund or I go straight to PayPal complaints.

They still came back with $120 as I was getting a great watch for free.

Eventually they refunded $150 and I am left with a watch that will be my eternal reminder of my first and hopefully only dealings with a Scam site. I reckon $50 down is a good result as it could have been a lot worse.

 

I move on with a great lesson learned.... If the TDs don't have it then FORGET it.

[bme 4]

If the TDs don't have it then FORGET it.

 

Best quote ever!!!