Fake Watches and Customs Examination

[Tressles61 0]

I know where this receipt is from... I am waiting on a shipment from them too. Just a couple of cheap watches and a strap to take apart and dink around with and if I ruin them no big deal.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I can send them this but I doubt it will help ...

 

 

Well, I have already contacted the dealer.

[kloshar 0]

Well, I actually got the bill and I think a really good one!

 

Will send it right away.

[Member X 91]

Cool, post pics when it arrives.

[kloshar 0]

No Rolex for me, I probably live in some Banana republic or ... :/

 

I recived a notification that I got a letter waiting for me in the Post Office. I went there contented to finally get my watch after a whole month of waiting. But instead of watch, I got a WRITTEN ORDER from CUSTOMS OFFICE. They actually made whole legal procedure of this. :/ I've got 10 days to declare whether the watch is original or not, because there exist a founded suspicion that a watch infringe some rights of intelectual property. In the case of my secrecy and on demand of Slovenian Rolex agent, the watch will be ruined. That Rolex agent also has a right to put in a suit against me. :/

 

They estimated that a watch is worth 100€, eventhough I sent them a bill that shows the watch costed 30$.

 

Ohhh, I'm so pissed out. Stupid Customs!!! What can I do now? I can't even get another watch.

Edited June 28, 2010 by kloshar

[Baldrick 1]

I can't agree with you that Customs are stupid, seems to me they've been very efficient and vigilant at protecting the rights of the OFFICIAL Slovenian Rolex importer, you took a gamble and lost, looks like you need a different gambling strategy.

 

BTW, aren't you the guy that was deriding everyone for buying fakes and telling us that 30+ year old Slovenians wouldn't be seen dead wearing a fake Rolex.

 

Looks like you won't be wearing one either, dead or alive....biter bit and all that

[kloshar 0]

Ignoring the unnecessary post above, here is the dealer's reply.

 

Thanks so much for your info. please don't worry about that, you can go to get the watch from your Customs, we had placed an paper into the box, and what you should tell the stupid Customs is the watch is repaired watch, if they wanna charge you or tax you, please refuse , and we will ship you a new one soon, or maybe with your next order. so please dob't be scared, just be brave !

 

Waiting for your good news

 

They are clever, aren't they?

 

But I am a bit affraid to lie like this - I don't want the thing go to the court. I will probably just leave everything and forget that 50€.

[trailboss99 997]

You showed them a bill???

Um, way to go to provide evidence that you knew it was a fake and that you ordered it.

Expect a law suite now mate. NEVER admit to knowing anything about a shipment they question, just say 'what watch? I never ordered a watch!'

 

 

Col.

[Wiz 0]

NEVER admit to knowing anything about a shipment they question, just say 'what watch? I never ordered a watch!'

That's mostly true for countries where the legal system is based on Common Law. In some other countries, like France, where the legal system is based on Civil Law, this strategy will only lead you to get a 1500 EUR fine instead of a 150 EUR one, because for small prejudices, it's up to the customs officer to determine the amount you'll have to pay (law only says it can go up to 10 times the price of the original good).

 

If you want to object the decision, the case will be taken to court, and no judge will ever believe that someone else ordered and paid for that watch just for you to enjoy it, so basically you'll pay court fees along with the original fine. You can't also say that you didn't knew the watch was fake, or that you didn't knew it was a replica, because the law on concealment says that you're supposed to know.

 

In France the best strategy is to admit what you did and say that you didn't realized it was such a big deal (because that's what the customs officer will try to tell you).

Edited June 28, 2010 by wiz

[kloshar 0]

Well, the bill isn't really showing that I actually bought the watch. It just says: Sport watch, quantity and the price. The dealer told me to tell them it was a repaired watch.

 

I really don't know what to do now. I'm affraid the Customs do not believe that kind of shit.

[Wiz 0]

Well, the bill isn't really showing that I actually bought the watch. It just says: Sport watch, quantity and the price. The dealer told me to tell them it was a repaired watch.

 

I really don't know what to do now. I'm affraid the Customs do not believe that kind of shit.

 

Your best bet is to ask someone who knows about Slovenian customs and/or legal system. Laws and concealments are so different from one country to another that you need to find someone who knows about the Solvenian's particularities.

[kloshar 0]

NEVER admit to knowing anything about a shipment they question, just say 'what watch? I never ordered a watch!'

That's mostly true for countries where the legal system is based on Common Law. In some other countries, like France, where the legal system is based on Civil Law, this strategy will only lead you to get a 1500 EUR fine instead of a 150 EUR one, because for small prejudices, it's up to the customs officer to determine the amount you'll have to pay (law only says it can go up to 10 times the price of the original good).

 

If you want to object the decision, the case will be taken to court, and no judge will ever believe that someone else ordered and paid for that watch just for enjoy it, so basically you'll pay court fees along with the original fine. You can't also say that you didn't knew the watch was fake, or that you didn't knew it was a replica, because the law on concealment says that you're supposed to know.

 

In France the best strategy is to admit what you did and say that you didn't realized it was such a big deal (because that's what the customs officer will try to tell you).

 

If the thing goes to the court (what I personally doubt), I will say that I didn't even know what Rolex mean and that I liked the style of the watch. I will say that if I knew the watch was fake, I would never order it.

 

Ignoratia facti non nocet.

[Baldrick 1]

Well, the bill isn't really showing that I actually bought the watch. It just says: Sport watch, quantity and the price

 

OK, Einstein, if you didn't buy the watch, why would you have a 'bill', and why would you enter into discussions with them with regard to it and subsequently deny knowledge of it, you're right at the cutting edge aren't you

 

 

If the thing goes to the court (what I personally doubt), I will say that I didn't even know what Rolex mean and that I liked the style of the watch. I will say that if I knew the watch was fake, I would never order it.

What a brilliantly conceived legal strategy, I think Admin should make that a sticky as the de facto defense for all members

[Wiz 0]

If the thing goes to the court (what I personally doubt), I will say that I didn't even know what Rolex mean and that I liked the style of the watch. I will say that if I knew the watch was fake, I would never order it.

 

Ignoratia facti non nocet.

Don't know about Slovenian law, but French law on concealment says that you're supposed to know, so we can't do that here.

[Baldrick 1]

Ignorance of the law in virtually all countries is never an excuse, you committed a crime, now you have to do the time

[Brightlight 0]

What are Slovenian prisons like nowadays?

[Wiz 0]

Actually Slovenia has becomed a pretty modern and successful country, so I bet prisons may be better that what we can find in some of our countries.

Edited June 28, 2010 by wiz

[Brightlight 0]

Actually Slovenia has becomed a pretty modern and successful country, so I bet prisons may be better that what we can find in some of our countries.

 

Oh well that's some comfort to the OP

[Baldrick 1]

Full of Slovenians that wouldn't be seen dead wearing a fake Rolex, but with defense strategies that would have Oliver Wendell Holmes spinning in his grave

[kloshar 0]

If the thing goes to the court (what I personally doubt), I will say that I didn't even know what Rolex mean and that I liked the style of the watch. I will say that if I knew the watch was fake, I would never order it.

 

Ignoratia facti non nocet.

Don't know about Slovenian law, but French law on concealment says that you're supposed to know, so we can't do that here.

 

You are supposed to know what can you do and what you can't do. If there is a rule that you must not buy fake watches and you consciously buy it, you conform against the rule and you can't refer to not knowing the rule. But if you buy a watch which you do not know it is fake, you are not mistaken about the rule itself but about the object of the contract. Therefore you can refer to your error about the object and the contract is null. This is the only defence I see. Ignorantia iuris nocet, ignorantia facti non nocet.

 

A famous Slovenian songwritter once said: Do not rob nails in this country, but factories.

 

OK, Einstein, if you didn't buy the watch, why would you have a 'bill', and why would you enter into discussions with them with regard to it and subsequently deny knowledge of it, you're right at the cutting edge aren't you cool.gif

 

A bill might also mean that a watchsmit repaired the watch or sth similar. It does not necessarly mean a buying contract. For now, I did not do anything. I just say what dealer have told me to and I say what will I say if it comes to suit.

Edited June 28, 2010 by kloshar

[dingle 57]

anxious to see what happens

 

[kloshar 0]

Btw, this guy actually sells replica scams over net and nobody legaly prosecutes him for it: C L I C K

 

I wonder how he got all these watches ...

Edited June 28, 2010 by kloshar

[Brightlight 0]

A bill might also mean that a watchsmit repaired the watch or sth similar. It does not necessarly mean a buying contract. For now, I did not do anything. I just say what dealer have told me to and I say what will I say if it comes to suit.

 

I really don't think that will help. It appears, if Rolex has got involved, that there is no doubt it is a fake, which look at it how you will, is still illegal, and if you had sent a fake out of the country for repair you must therefore have brought it into the country in the first place. Customs officials are not stupid and they see this sort of thing often. Don't underestimate them, that could be dangerous.

[kloshar 0]

Yes, I see that. Therefore I decided I will ignore everything connected with the watch. The Order was not delivered to some Slovenian Rolex vendory agent, but directly to their legal representative in Slo. Lawyer, to be precise. I will see what is going to happen, as said before, my defense will be ignorance. I will probably also order this watch to support my evidence, that I didn't order it because it is a fake, but because I like that diving watch style.

[Wiz 0]

If the thing goes to the court (what I personally doubt), I will say that I didn't even know what Rolex mean and that I liked the style of the watch. I will say that if I knew the watch was fake, I would never order it. :(

 

Ignoratia facti non nocet. :P

Don't know about Slovenian law, but French law on concealment says that you're supposed to know, so we can't do that here.

 

You are supposed to know what can you do and what you can't do. If there is a rule that you must not buy fake watches and you consciously buy it, you conform against the rule and you can't refer to not knowing the rule. But if you buy a watch which you do not know it is fake, you are not mistaken about the rule itself but about the object of the contract. Therefore you can refer to your error about the object and the contract is null. This is the only defence I see. Ignorantia iuris nocet, ignorantia facti non nocet.

Dude, if you choose to use legal terms, at least try to use the right ones. Also, I guess you should stop Latin too, because why in the world would you defend yourself saying that no-one is supposed to ignore the law??

 

What I meant is that you can't claim that you didn't knew that "hublot" or "jaeger lecoultre" are known brands that are worth $$$, that you through the fake watches you bought were just cheapos. Understand?

 

I really feel like I'm being clear on this one, so I'm not going to spend more time on this. In the end that's not my problem.

Edited June 28, 2010 by wiz

[Wiz 0]

Yes, I see that. Therefore I decided I will ignore everything connected with the watch. The Order was not delivered to some Slovenian Rolex vendory agent, but directly to their legal representative in Slo. Lawyer, to be precise. I will see what is going to happen, as said before, my defense will be ignorance. I will probably also order this watch to support my evidence, that I didn't order it because it is a fake, but because I like that diving watch style.

 

Ordering another watch will only show that you buy watches on the internet, which is an indication that you could be the buyer of the rep...

But go ahead, customs officers have a difficult job. They'll be please to get an easy case for once...