Ploprof Crystal

[sfa437 0]

Well you're all aware of my neverending story watching my crystal delaminate. Never got the SOB to separate but I did manage to clear up some of the delamination with a little bit of Wahl Machine Oil.

 

I also managed to get the thing out of the case without removing the bezel. An old watchmaker once said "If you're forcing it, you're doing it wrong". I said "Eff him" and took a 1" wooden dowel and a claw hammer to the thing and got it out after 3 solid whacks

 

Here's what it looks like with the laminate structure obvious:

 

 

 

Here's the measurement of the crystal for those worried about the same thing happening

 

 

 

Seems to be 29.5mm x 5mm My calipers took a shlt so I couldn't get a spot-on measurement :Talk to the Hand:

 

Good news is that it is simply a round crystal and not like the gen construction and should be easy to source!

[houndoggie 58]

thanks for the info.

 

 

It is about the gen thickness though.

 

 

get some calipers on it!!!

[sfa437 0]

thanks for the info.

 

 

It is about the gen thickness though.

 

 

get some calipers on it!!!

 

Gotta buy me a new pair tomorrow at the Home Depot.

 

Now to decide if I want mineral or sapphire....

[gran 198]

Great work!

 

Hammer always works

[JoeyB 0]

An old watchmaker once said "If you're forcing it, you're doing it wrong". I said "Eff him" and took a 1" wooden dowel and a claw hammer to the thing and got it out after 3 solid whacks

Force? That's just a nudge. :Talk to the Hand:

[OHMYGODITSAPANERAI 0]

I bet they just used a crappy glue. I would try to get it apart and use the UV glue that is used on the Rolex cyclops's. It dries crystal clear.

Of course, just sourcing a 1 piece crystal should not be hard.

[sfa437 0]

Now I'm going nuts trying to find a supplier of 5mm thick crystals. I swear the rep gods hate me

[avenger007 29]

WWWWWHHHHHHYYYYYYY??????!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[sfa437 0]

I'd settle for a new crystal so I could treat the edges myself

 

Here's the measurements- seems like it is going to be a cast iron SOB to find.....

 

 

[offshore 0]

P,

I'm guessing its a 1.5 sapphire laminated to a 3.0 MG?

 

So the question is did you just suffer from a bad lamination...(I did see someone else experiencing an issue) or are they all like this, just not being reported yet.

The other thought which crossed my mind, is did the manufacturers try a few different "samples" from various suppliers, and you just drew the short straw?

The 289 shouldn't be an issue..(I have MG 3mm 289's in stock) and I suspect the 1.5 sapphire won't prove a major headache...its the lamination which is obviously the issue.

 

Back to my 2nd question...if they finally are all like this....surely the dealers will have to talk to the factory and get a supply of "good" product. If this is a one off, or limited quantity QC issue, wouldn't it be better just to get another 1 (or 2) replacements from the supplier?

I s'pose the million $$ question right now is if the issue is with all crystals, not just a few random QC failures, and that may not be answered for a little while.

However I think the answers to this one initially, at least, must be generated by the dealers/factory.

O/S

[sfa437 0]

O/S

 

I have a feeling we are going to be seeing a lot more of these issues popping up. Two reported in a few days is a tad unusual- especially since one started delaminating in the rain

 

Been trying to get a new one from the dealer but no luck as of yet. Any idea if you could get ahold of a 28.9x4.5mm solid sapphire?

[sconehead 5]

3.00mm thick seems to be the thickest available from CousinsUK mate, hence the lamination...

 

Edit: UV glue as mentioned above is probably the solution...

[offshore 0]

It'll be a non production run for sure.

So I guess you need to hope for 100+ failures

 

As mentioned by chief elsewhere, they won't be cheap, and no one will look at a sapphire run at under 100 pieces. (maybe even more)

Obviously the factory...realising they needed this 4.5 thickness, have commissioned their crystal supplier to do it the cheapest way....and the supplier has just glued together a stock 1.5 and 3.0mm.

I'm wondering if its just a glue failure on a couple of crystals, or the crystal people were "experimenting" ( I can't believe they would knowingly use a water based glue BTW...I'm still thinking contamination and water is just getting between a delamination which already existed)

Surely the UV which is used to do cyclops is the way to go ( I have successfully used Loctite 358 for that)..although I am wondering how it would "spread" over the much larger area??

 

If you are sure the delamination is caused by water...why not encourage the process with more water, then use acetone (or water) to clean off the old glue once seperated? Then try a reglue?

 

If it is a contamination delamination, soaking the thing in acetone ( as long as you are 100% sure neither bit is acrylic ) will finally seperate the 2 parts. Then you could try to rebond them.

 

O/S

[JoeyB 0]

What about trying an eye glasses place? I've seen people wearing thick lenses, and they shape them right there.

If it was me I'd get the 'reader' ones and actually be able to read the date...

[offshore 0]

P,

I just checked a couple of crystal manufacturers catalogues.

Now, one of them does a stock range of 1.5 sapphires, however they are only available in 0.5 increments, which means you can get a 290 then a 295. (As said the 291 in MG is no issue)

Now GS http://www.gssupplies.com/, state they will do a custom sapphire run at 20 pieces...however I think you would need to mortgage the house and your wife, just to make the deposit!

I'm thinking the solution will have to come from China, probably GZ or HK.

We need someone with crystal know how, on the ground, to door knock the various suppliers, if we are going to drive it from this side. I have been trying for almost 6 months to put together a Pam sapphire deal, with zero luck.... (its all in the language interpretation).....I was hoping to try to sort that one in a couple of weeks...I was going to the Shenzhen show....however I have had to call off that trip.... and I'm now planning on going to HK in September.

 

Probably worth an inquiry to GS, but don't hold your breath.

O/S

[offshore 0]

What about trying an eye glasses place? I've seen people wearing thick lenses, and they shape them right there.

If it was me I'd get the 'reader' ones and actually be able to read the date...

 

Good thought Joey....although "mag" styles are curved top surface/flat bottom. As are most eyeglass lens.

But many of the eyeglass guys have grinders to cut both diameter and thickness...I'm not sure what material is used for eyeglasses though, and don't think its sapphire!

But certainly worth an investigate.

A lot of the eyeglass shops even have grinders in house now, so a local guy may be worth a call.

O/S

[sfa437 0]

My mineral is buggered so I'll prolly kick you a PM if I can get the two separated and pick up the 3mm mineral. I was looking at GS and I'd have to make a run of 10,000 to make it cost effective per piece The sapphire is fine so if I can split the two apart I'll reuse that. TBH I'd like a full thickness MG one just to be on the safe side.

 

The adhesive used is water soluble as odd as it sounds- I can feel the stickiness after I submerge it.

[gran 198]

Wonder what the dealers are thinking about the PloProf?

 

I guess it is in their interest to find a solution for this problem? I guess sales are gonna stale now

[offshore 0]

P,

I'm looking at that 291 right now. It has a chamfer on the top face...I'm guessing 0.1 or 0.2mm...bottom edge is square.

PM your addy and I'll stick it in the mail N/C...need to get something happening on this.

I can get more 291's in bulk from my guy in HK...and I'm sure they will be everywhere in the GZ markets so as said the 291MG's aren't an issue.

I noted someone @ RWI made a comment about another style UV glue. Did you make further inquiries on that one? I would be worried that a standard UV wouldn't give an absolutely "smear" free finish. Maybe that glue is also worth a try? When you bond with UV you get adhesion in about 1 hour (so you would know what finish you were getting then)..but it is 24 hours until "hard". So easy to seperate if you had to.

I also have some "Chinese" UV here...I will do a test on it later today.....and see if it is water soluble

 

O/S

[sfa437 0]

Well we've got 4 confirmed cases of delamination starting at the 12 o'clock position. Mine was the worst (total submerge for 10 min). The others started off from being in the rain.

 

Looks like it might be an issue with them all....

 

The 21j Ploprof supposedly has a solid MG crystal- any way to confirm diameter on it?

[offshore 0]

P,

Just thinking about this further.

If that bloody dinky plastic sealing ring was doing its job, NO water would have gotten near the join!

Not excusing using water soluble glue for the lamination, however it again shows how useless those bloody inserts are.

Go oversize and glue the fucker in, no water will get near it then!

I know this doesn't help with the existing problem, but you may need to rethink the size crystal you are going to re afix.

O/S

[JoeyB 0]

What about trying an eye glasses place? I've seen people wearing thick lenses, and they shape them right there.

If it was me I'd get the 'reader' ones and actually be able to read the date...

 

Good thought Joey....although "mag" styles are curved top surface/flat bottom. As are most eyeglass lens.

But many of the eyeglass guys have grinders to cut both diameter and thickness...I'm not sure what material is used for eyeglasses though, and don't think its sapphire!

But certainly worth an investigate.

A lot of the eyeglass shops even have grinders in house now, so a local guy may be worth a call.

O/S

Oh, I highly doubt it's sapphire. I don'y know how they do the optics, but I thought they 'grind' the convex to get the prescription, so they have to be starting out with a clear glass/whatever. Odds are whatever they are using today would be unbreakable and totally clear/distortion free.

[Luthier 1]

Try this:

 

http://www.cmcrystals.com/english/index.asp

 

I have good relationships with this factory, but OS can ask Mary for help too.

[sfa437 0]

Have seen a few more of these crystals go bad over the past few days- seems like it might be more are bad than good.

[houndoggie 58]

Have seen a few more of these crystals go bad over the past few days- seems like it might be more are bad than good.

 

 

I bought mine from Josh, so seeing all these crystal problems spurned me to email him and ask him what he plans to about it. Mine hasn't had any issues, but I don't doubt it will.

 

I'll keep you updated.