Necromancer 8 Posted April 15, 2014 I received a $75 Silix Rolex Sub 21j automatic special just 3 weeks ago and while pulling out the crown to set the time, the stem has just pulled right out of the case. It's only been used 3-4 times and previously all seemed ok and I always pull the crown out very gently. I've never so much as opened the back of any of my reps before - cheapies or higher grade (I have five now) but I do have a basic watch repair kit and I'm happy to take a look at this one for the experience. So what I'm asking is - a) Is this likely to be an easy and obvious fix? (I'm sure many of you must have had this happen before) b) Is it going to be less hassle to replace the movement? c) Is it worth sending to a watch repairer? (I'm in the UK) d) Is it worth even considering contacting the TD for return/repair on a cheap 'special' The watch is actually pretty decent for the price and I would like to get it going again. Here's a link to the watch on the TD site if it helps - http://www.silix-prime.so/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=116_205_214&products_id=5078 Any advice, thought or comments are welcome, Thanks! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WPoste 0 Posted April 15, 2014 This happened to me with a Rolex rep which was much more pricey. I sent it back and they sent me back a new watch. I assume it isn't an easy fix since they didn't repair it but replaced it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fatarms 7,777 Posted April 15, 2014 There's a small button you have to gently push to reinsert the stem. You'll have to take the caseback off first. If it still won't stay in, then the keyless works are messed up and will have to be reset. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fatarms 7,777 Posted April 15, 2014 Usually the little button looks like this on a 21J http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7183/6841800082_2d7ec8d4ac_o.jpg Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 15, 2014 What happens when you put the stem back in and gently turn the crown, pushing at the same time? Does the crown screw in? If that doesn't work, it's certainly worth taking off the caseback and trying to push the button gently as you turn the crown back and forth. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 15, 2014 What happens when you put the stem back in and gently turn the crown, pushing at the same time? Does the crown screw in? If that doesn't work, it's certainly worth taking off the caseback and trying to push the button gently as you turn the crown back and forth. When I put the stem back in and push gently, it is at the 'time set' position. It will push further, but I feel a springy resistance that pushes it back out again Thanks for advice so far! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aren 27 Posted April 15, 2014 Press the the little button (the detent) and try to insert the stem and see if it will catch. You shouldn't force it. Fatarm's gave you a good photo of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 15, 2014 What happens when you put the stem back in and gently turn the crown, pushing at the same time? Does the crown screw in? If that doesn't work, it's certainly worth taking off the caseback and trying to push the button gently as you turn the crown back and forth. When I put the stem back in and push gently, it is at the 'time set' position. It will push further, but I feel a springy resistance that pushes it back out again Thanks for advice so far! It's OK, the springy resistance is on the crown end. Push it in gently while turning. You may feel a click as it goes in. If the keyless is damaged you won't be able to make it seat properly but in that case it's beyond just pushing anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
myaz 3 Posted April 15, 2014 I've got an inexpensive Russian watch whose stem comes out occasionally if I pull on it a little too hard, I'm mentally picturing that the catch that holds the stem is worn. What I'm saying is that it could happen again after you figure out how to put it back in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 15, 2014 What happens when you put the stem back in and gently turn the crown, pushing at the same time? Does the crown screw in? If that doesn't work, it's certainly worth taking off the caseback and trying to push the button gently as you turn the crown back and forth. When I put the stem back in and push gently, it is at the 'time set' position. It will push further, but I feel a springy resistance that pushes it back out again Thanks for advice so far! It's OK, the springy resistance is on the crown end. Push it in gently while turning. You may feel a click as it goes in. If the keyless is damaged you won't be able to make it seat properly but in that case it's beyond just pushing anyway. Pushing it in and turning anti clockwise - I hear a click but it doesn't seat Pushing it in and turning clockwise - it simply screws the crown down but whilst moving the hands - but comes straight back out again when unscrewed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 16, 2014 Update - I took the back off today, found the detent button (thanks fatarms) and tried to gently insert the stem. It went in but would not seem to catch or hold. The watch stops when the stem is fully inserted but usually starts when the stem is pulled out a little. Also, the rotor appears to have suddenly become noisier. Any further help or comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
J.Eric 693 Posted April 16, 2014 (edited) I just went through this with my DSSD. The clutch lever #435 came off the clutch wheel #407... A simple fix if you have done a keyless repair before. This was 10th or 11th time I have done a reset. There are a few tutorials on how to do this... http://www.rwg.bz/bo...?showtopic=4295 http://www.rwg.bz/bo...?showtopic=4315 EDIT: I just realized yours was a 21j. this wont help much. Sorry... Edited April 16, 2014 by J.Eric Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdog 1 Posted April 16, 2014 Sounds like it needs a keyless fix. My opinion for that particular watch is a new 21j 2813 or whatever mvmnt. Run you about $30 or so. A bit more will get you a keyless fix from a repairer. But add in 2 way shipping its easier/cheaper to get a new movement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 16, 2014 Update - I took the back off today, found the detent button (thanks fatarms) and tried to gently insert the stem. It went in but would not seem to catch or hold. The watch stops when the stem is fully inserted but usually starts when the stem is pulled out a little. Also, the rotor appears to have suddenly become noisier. Any further help or comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. This needs a watchsmith to investigate. I think you have proven beyond reasonable doubt that it's not a simple fix. Sorry mate. The next question is how much are you prepared to pay a watchsmith to fix this? A new movement is only £30 from CousinsUK - but then you will have to install it yourself or pay someone to do it. You are about to start on the law of diminishing returns. Welcome to the world of reps. Whereabouts are you? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twofake 0 Posted April 16, 2014 Yes the new movement option or have a go at fixing it and maybe learn a lot as well as save $30 or more. What have you got to lose? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 16, 2014 Update - I took the back off today, found the detent button (thanks fatarms) and tried to gently insert the stem. It went in but would not seem to catch or hold. The watch stops when the stem is fully inserted but usually starts when the stem is pulled out a little. Also, the rotor appears to have suddenly become noisier. Any further help or comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. This needs a watchsmith to investigate. I think you have proven beyond reasonable doubt that it's not a simple fix. Sorry mate. The next question is how much are you prepared to pay a watchsmith to fix this? A new movement is only £30 from CousinsUK - but then you will have to install it yourself or pay someone to do it. You are about to start on the law of diminishing returns. Welcome to the world of reps. Whereabouts are you? I'm in County Durham, North East England. I've always liked to tinker with things, but usually guitars and amplifier electronics. I've read the book kindly donated by black263 and as mentioned, this might be a good project to give me some experience! Thanks to everyone for the input. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 16, 2014 The first job I did on a watch was to change a 21j movement. Not difficult if you are careful and read up well first. I did more or less the same job for a mate on Tuesday without thinking too much about it. Actually it was more complicated because it was an Explorer with a GMT hand. Go for it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 16, 2014 The first job I did on a watch was to change a 21j movement. Not difficult if you are careful and read up well first. I did more or less the same job for a mate on Tuesday without thinking too much about it. Actually it was more complicated because it was an Explorer with a GMT hand. Go for it! Thanks for the encouragement JSJ, I'll give it a go. Is CousinsUK the place to order? Just as an afterthought, is this type of problem to be expected from a $75 'special' - would the problem have been known when it was sold, maybe a customer return, or have I just been unlucky and it could have happened with a higher quality rep too? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 16, 2014 It's where I bought my DG2813. Probably better take some movement pics and let the assembled masses on here advise on the movement. I'm not an expert on movements in subs so someone else had better look. Also maybe you don't need to change the datewheel which will be easier. Mine was a Planet Ocean so I had to. As for the problems, I'd say it's not unusual and I'd not suspect skullduggery. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Necromancer 8 Posted April 26, 2014 Going to have a go at replacing the movement :help3: Next questions! Is the DG2813 a direct replacement without any mods needed? is the DG4813 the same but with a higher BPH? Both movements are the same price on CousinsUK, but the 4813 movement height seems to be 1mm less? Help again please! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 27, 2014 Going to have a go at replacing the movement :help3: Next questions! Is the DG2813 a direct replacement without any mods needed? is the DG4813 the same but with a higher BPH? Both movements are the same price on CousinsUK, but the 4813 movement height seems to be 1mm less? . Help again please! The 4813 which CousinsUK sell is a 21600 movement. The cannon pinion is shorter hence the reduced height. I have one so I found out the hard way! I believed the stuff about the 4813 being high beat and ordered one. I don't doubt that some 4813s are high beat, just not the one I bought from CousinsUK. It has a 4813 sticker on the packaging. Still need some pics of your movement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DR3M3L 4 Posted April 27, 2014 Going to have a go at replacing the movement :help3: Next questions! Is the DG2813 a direct replacement without any mods needed? is the DG4813 the same but with a higher BPH? Both movements are the same price on CousinsUK, but the 4813 movement height seems to be 1mm less? . Help again please! The 4813 which CousinsUK sell is a 21600 movement. The cannon pinion is shorter hence the reduced height. I have one so I found out the hard way! I believed the stuff about the 4813 being high beat and ordered one. I don't doubt that some 4813s are high beat, just not the one I bought from CousinsUK. It has a 4813 sticker on the packaging.Still need some pics of your movement. There is a highbeat and a lowbeat version, I got some from Ebay Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JSJ 0 Posted April 27, 2014 Going to have a go at replacing the movement :help3: Next questions! Is the DG2813 a direct replacement without any mods needed? is the DG4813 the same but with a higher BPH? Both movements are the same price on CousinsUK, but the 4813 movement height seems to be 1mm less? . Help again please! The 4813 which CousinsUK sell is a 21600 movement. The cannon pinion is shorter hence the reduced height. I have one so I found out the hard way! I believed the stuff about the 4813 being high beat and ordered one. I don't doubt that some 4813s are high beat, just not the one I bought from CousinsUK. It has a 4813 sticker on the packaging.Still need some pics of your movement. There is a highbeat and a lowbeat version, I got some from Ebay Yes I'm sure there is. Just that the CousinsUK one is low beat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ROLIE 46 Posted April 27, 2014 Update - I took the back off today, found the detent button (thanks fatarms) and tried to gently insert the stem. It went in but would not seem to catch or hold. The watch stops when the stem is fully inserted but usually starts when the stem is pulled out a little. Also, the rotor appears to have suddenly become noisier. Any further help or comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. This needs a watchsmith to investigate. I think you have proven beyond reasonable doubt that it's not a simple fix. Sorry mate. The next question is how much are you prepared to pay a watchsmith to fix this? A new movement is only £30 from CousinsUK - but then you will have to install it yourself or pay someone to do it. You are about to start on the law of diminishing returns. Welcome to the world of reps. Whereabouts are you? I'm in County Durham, North East England. I've always liked to tinker with things, but usually guitars and amplifier electronics. I've read the book kindly donated by black263 and as mentioned, this might be a good project to give me some experience! Thanks to everyone for the input. HI im in county durham and ill fix it for you for free just drop me a pm and ifyou want you can bring it round to me always happy to help fellow member Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hazz 0 Posted April 27, 2014 Update - I took the back off today, found the detent button (thanks fatarms) and tried to gently insert the stem. It went in but would not seem to catch or hold. The watch stops when the stem is fully inserted but usually starts when the stem is pulled out a little. Also, the rotor appears to have suddenly become noisier. Any further help or comments would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. This needs a watchsmith to investigate. I think you have proven beyond reasonable doubt that it's not a simple fix. Sorry mate. The next question is how much are you prepared to pay a watchsmith to fix this? A new movement is only £30 from CousinsUK - but then you will have to install it yourself or pay someone to do it. You are about to start on the law of diminishing returns. Welcome to the world of reps. Whereabouts are you? I'm in County Durham, North East England. I've always liked to tinker with things, but usually guitars and amplifier electronics. I've read the book kindly donated by black263 and as mentioned, this might be a good project to give me some experience! Thanks to everyone for the input. HI im in county durham and ill fix it for you for free just drop me a pm and ifyou want you can bring it round to me always happy to help fellow member You can't ask for better than that, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
